From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: uzibalqa via "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#58459: Getting a fresh emacs session with no customisation Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2022 12:52:43 +0000 Message-ID: References: <0geQIvut8pm1-9SAaI008CzSdp1E-IUa3kruCxKwrH66Gg92tJgKScNSDWJwuueXmV78tcULC_N_c9LG5MADKiD3_AjkXcNQTMQ6soTqIlc=@proton.me> <3gN0Jqr94UeUj3xJtDV3zGvZVbUyjtQFAloYxrdvwN_ZHa3tEUYyFv8h3VcYYSk_gxgMaaBW94kAkaAUCgbd9QKZMkkYJBty-7XOadbzHHQ=@proton.me> <87fsfsc9af.fsf@yahoo.com> <87zgdzc3vl.fsf@yahoo.com> Reply-To: uzibalqa Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="28621"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Phil Sainty , 58459@debbugs.gnu.org, Stefan Kangas To: Po Lu Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Thu Oct 13 16:10:48 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1oiyv9-0007DV-78 for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 13 Oct 2022 16:10:47 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:50634 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oiyv7-0004Np-Oy for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 13 Oct 2022 10:10:45 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:46208) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oixis-00089l-I0 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 13 Oct 2022 08:54:03 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.43]:60810) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oixis-0007Fy-9e for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 13 Oct 2022 08:54:02 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oixir-0003lh-QF for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 13 Oct 2022 08:54:01 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: uzibalqa Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2022 12:54:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 58459 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: notabug Original-Received: via spool by 58459-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B58459.166566558414415 (code B ref 58459); Thu, 13 Oct 2022 12:54:01 +0000 Original-Received: (at 58459) by debbugs.gnu.org; 13 Oct 2022 12:53:04 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:59888 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oixhw-0003kR-5y for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 13 Oct 2022 08:53:04 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-40132.protonmail.ch ([185.70.40.132]:49591) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oixhr-0003jt-8l for 58459@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 13 Oct 2022 08:53:02 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=proton.me; s=protonmail; t=1665665572; x=1665924772; bh=musGNEwop0jYYmgbDBpxDcX2LNoeOhz92CxG5EkI/MI=; h=Date:To:From:Cc:Subject:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:References: Feedback-ID:From:To:Cc:Date:Subject:Reply-To:Feedback-ID: Message-ID; b=Rqxm1Xed9vG3F4i/f86xVFsZrIuHizaLKPglRI51PE+87m65M4mLJS04dYqdURzhh PmcUsadroH/lh7fhGa+0fWVSrpo4EGDDPAVAc9HO6niS1zhR/0RxhmzN4VVVLb8WqY cx4JYNF6DAZAL80B0zBtoLEQF6HvKTXDMxYcrRZhjQsoBImevhu+PwHhhcn0b4G1z0 b1gXedyk4UcU4AWyydCvt/jdWfjSoyPlpA1i2CDFxCboc1+VYi8tkFV1ZdhCfoIK24 2Bb/rxYDUsulHVJsse5CPufTQOX4eHBFBwojetmke1l5Pkdjeh2Uyt/TkMgO592/th OJZtmqKAB/fyA== In-Reply-To: <87zgdzc3vl.fsf@yahoo.com> Feedback-ID: 52887082:user:proton X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "bug-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:245308 Archived-At: ------- Original Message ------- On Thursday, October 13th, 2022 at 12:19 PM, Po Lu wro= te: > uzibalqa uzibalqa@proton.me writes: >=20 > > You can't even tell me which process is producing them and where. >=20 >=20 > Because I don't know? How would I know what is installed on your > system? Right. And I do not know either whatever my system has done to impose some x-resources that emacs is taking as authority. Suppose I had set some of those resources myself and want to use them, then I should specify= =20 them like I do with my init file. =20 But things are working the other way round. Things get messed up, then hav= e to figure out what produced it, thing gets too complicated beyond what I co= nsciously did, then emacs uses them. Does a user have control this way? Of course n= ot. =20 > > Emacs should take the user's setting in the init file rather than overr= ide them > > with bullshit that you reckon has authority. >=20 >=20 > Did you bother to read the X(7) manual page at all? If not, I suggest > grabbing a copy off here: >=20 > https://www.x.org/archive/X11R7.7/doc/man/man7/X.7.xhtml#heading14 >=20 > When you run Emacs with nothing in your init file, there will be > nothing there to take priority over X resources. My challenge in why emacs is taking authority from x-resources. Rather tha= n firing vanilla emacs with some properly defined face with good accessibilit= y. If one is sure that he has set x-resources as he want, one can specify eith= er in the init file or in the command line where that information is. Current= ly something sets the x-resources, nobody knows what (certainly not the user i= n=20 this case), and then emacs imposes whatever there is. It is a bad strategy= . If emacs maintainers are actually so smart, how long is it going to take ex= actly for vanilla emacs to start using some well defined accessibility metrics su= ch as modus-themes, so that the maximum number of users can comfortably use it= . I want you to look at this as a subject, not as an emotional thing. Becaus= e then=20 you will not look at it the right way. Which people have already started d= oing. The end seems to be always the same. Statements that I am this bad man, an= d this=20 other one, and so forth. =20