From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Drew Adams Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#18005: 24.4.50; In Emacs manual, tell users how to enter debugger for `user-error' errors Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2014 19:41:13 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: References: <6261d1cf-2fa0-48a4-a8f0-0727d270c0f2@default> <0ztx6mm464.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1405219351 13683 80.91.229.3 (13 Jul 2014 02:42:31 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2014 02:42:31 +0000 (UTC) To: Glenn Morris , 18005@debbugs.gnu.org Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sun Jul 13 04:42:24 2014 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1X69k7-0007E6-DM for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sun, 13 Jul 2014 04:42:23 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:50967 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1X69k6-0007Zc-TL for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sat, 12 Jul 2014 22:42:22 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:34403) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1X69jv-0007Yc-FH for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 12 Jul 2014 22:42:20 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1X69jm-0005IV-GQ for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 12 Jul 2014 22:42:11 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.43]:58107) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1X69jm-0005Hv-Dy for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 12 Jul 2014 22:42:02 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1X69jl-0008PP-TW for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 12 Jul 2014 22:42:02 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Drew Adams Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2014 02:42:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 18005 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: wontfix Original-Received: via spool by 18005-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B18005.140521929032282 (code B ref 18005); Sun, 13 Jul 2014 02:42:01 +0000 Original-Received: (at 18005) by debbugs.gnu.org; 13 Jul 2014 02:41:30 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:53373 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1X69jG-0008Ob-0I for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 12 Jul 2014 22:41:30 -0400 Original-Received: from userp1040.oracle.com ([156.151.31.81]:40144) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1X69jC-0008ON-E5 for 18005@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 12 Jul 2014 22:41:26 -0400 Original-Received: from acsinet21.oracle.com (acsinet21.oracle.com [141.146.126.237]) by userp1040.oracle.com (Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2/Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2) with ESMTP id s6D2fJCT025922 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 13 Jul 2014 02:41:20 GMT Original-Received: from userz7022.oracle.com (userz7022.oracle.com [156.151.31.86]) by acsinet21.oracle.com (8.14.4+Sun/8.14.4) with ESMTP id s6D2fHGP005375 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Sun, 13 Jul 2014 02:41:18 GMT Original-Received: from abhmp0015.oracle.com (abhmp0015.oracle.com [141.146.116.21]) by userz7022.oracle.com (8.14.5+Sun/8.14.4) with ESMTP id s6D2fGUK004519; Sun, 13 Jul 2014 02:41:16 GMT In-Reply-To: <0ztx6mm464.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Oracle Beehive Extensions for Outlook 2.0.1.8 (707110) [OL 12.0.6691.5000 (x86)] X-Source-IP: acsinet21.oracle.com [141.146.126.237] X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 3.x X-Received-From: 140.186.70.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:91486 Archived-At: > The whole point of introducing user-error was so that uninteresting > errors will not trigger the debugger. I see no need to mention in the > *Emacs* manual how to get round this. "The whole point" should be to _let_ users not be bothered entering the debugger for uninteresting errors. That's reasonable behavior. *Enabling* that behavior is positive. Forcing it would be counterproductive, as is not making clear what it is that controls it. Not to mention the fact that what constitutes an "uninteresting error" is not something fixed once and for all for everyone. It can change, depending on the context. A user might well want to take a look under the covers using the debugger in some context. (The user who just now asked how to do it, for instance.) > (I am not going to get into a big debate about this.) No one asked you to.