From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Drew Adams Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#4755: 23.1; case where `C-M-x' on defcustom doesn't seem to work Date: Tue, 5 Jul 2016 10:30:33 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: References: <340F1FE0FD29493A984C1582F2B10756@us.oracle.com> <87poqsd8lc.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1467744127 19651 80.91.229.3 (5 Jul 2016 18:42:07 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 5 Jul 2016 18:42:07 +0000 (UTC) Cc: 4755@debbugs.gnu.org To: Noam Postavsky Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Jul 05 20:41:47 2016 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1bKVI3-0001b0-B3 for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Tue, 05 Jul 2016 20:41:47 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:57234 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bKVI2-0005lG-C4 for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Tue, 05 Jul 2016 14:41:46 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:45358) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bKUBf-0005aC-DP for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 05 Jul 2016 13:31:08 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bKUBa-0003Hn-8U for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 05 Jul 2016 13:31:06 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.43]:54438) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bKUBa-0003Hb-4v for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 05 Jul 2016 13:31:02 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bKUBZ-0008LM-R5 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 05 Jul 2016 13:31:01 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Drew Adams Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Tue, 05 Jul 2016 17:31:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 4755 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: unreproducible Original-Received: via spool by 4755-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B4755.146773984532047 (code B ref 4755); Tue, 05 Jul 2016 17:31:01 +0000 Original-Received: (at 4755) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Jul 2016 17:30:45 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:38542 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bKUBJ-0008Kp-5s for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 05 Jul 2016 13:30:45 -0400 Original-Received: from aserp1040.oracle.com ([141.146.126.69]:23032) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bKUBI-0008Kd-2r for 4755@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 05 Jul 2016 13:30:44 -0400 Original-Received: from aserv0022.oracle.com (aserv0022.oracle.com [141.146.126.234]) by aserp1040.oracle.com (Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2/Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2) with ESMTP id u65HUbx4019871 (version=TLSv1 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 5 Jul 2016 17:30:37 GMT Original-Received: from aserv0122.oracle.com (aserv0122.oracle.com [141.146.126.236]) by aserv0022.oracle.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id u65HUb5u019738 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 5 Jul 2016 17:30:37 GMT Original-Received: from abhmp0002.oracle.com (abhmp0002.oracle.com [141.146.116.8]) by aserv0122.oracle.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id u65HUYdP020991; Tue, 5 Jul 2016 17:30:36 GMT In-Reply-To: X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Oracle Beehive Extensions for Outlook 2.0.1.9 (901082) [OL 12.0.6744.5000 (x86)] X-Source-IP: aserv0022.oracle.com [141.146.126.234] X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 208.118.235.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "bug-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:120453 Archived-At: > > `foo', not `toto' was customized, and the Value shown > > here is correct. But the "Original value" is incorrect. > > The "Original value" shown is the new, current value > > of `foo'. `toto' never had, as still does not have, > > that "Original value". >=20 > Ah, but this appears to be expected behaviour: >=20 > (defcustom SYMBOL STANDARD DOC &rest ARGS) >=20 > [...] > STANDARD is an expression specifying the variable's standard > value. It should not be quoted. It is evaluated once by > `defcustom', and the value is assigned to SYMBOL if the variable > is unbound. The expression itself is also stored, so that > Customize can re-evaluate it later to get the standard value. > DOC is the variable documentation. >=20 > Compare what happens with: >=20 > (defcustom time (current-time) > "the time" > :type '(list integer)) I don't see why any of that indicates that what I described is "expected". But it does seem to confirm that there are problems. The "original value" should not change, and especially not just by using `C-h v'. It is wrong to say the "original value was" something that it never was and still is not! I don't see any evidence that that behavior is "expected" or is by design. > So perhaps the thing to be fixed is that describe-variable > should say "Standard value" rather than "Original value". I don't see how that would help. The doc you quote says that the std value is recomputed _by Customize_, by reevaluating the saved expression. Why should that affect `C-h v'? Also, `M-x customize-option time' shows this, which seems wrong. Seems like `C-h v' is taken as changing the value outside customize? State : CHANGED outside Customize. (mismatch) I have not reevaluated the defcustom at all. All I did was evaluate it once and then use `C-h v time' a few times. Anyway, there is a type mismatch. You should have used :type '(list integer integer integer integer). But even so, it does not seem right that a type mismatch should mess things up so much. For example, the State menu shows the item `Show Saved Lisp Expression' _disabled_. And it shows item `Revert This Session's Customization', even though I have done no customization. And if I choose `Revert...' there is no change in the menu. I'm guessing that these problems arise because there is a type mismatch. But they still shouldn't manifest this way, I think. Seems buggy. I did this with emacs -Q, with this Emacs 25 build: In GNU Emacs 25.1.50.1 (i686-pc-mingw32) of 2015-12-10 Repository revision: 6148555ee5a3d0139ae517803718b3e0357933c7 Windowing system distributor 'Microsoft Corp.', version 6.1.7601 Configured using: 'configure --prefix=3D/c/Devel/emacs/snapshot/trunk --enable-checking=3Dye= s --enable-check-lisp-object-type --without-compress-install 'CFLAGS=3D-Og -ggdb3' LDFLAGS=3D-Lc:/Devel/emacs/lib 'CPPFLAGS=3D-DGC_MCHECK=3D1 -Ic:/Devel/emacs/include'' Seems like we've stumbled on more than one bug here? Correcting the :type and trying again, with a new variable named `atime', I still see the State as CHANGED outside Customize. And again, that's just by evaluating the defcustom once and doing `C-h v' a couple times.