From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Drew Adams Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#33383: 26; `count-words-region' Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2019 07:28:32 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: References: <67fda5a6-8217-47ee-ae7f-fde4427433e0@default> <87ftne5adh.fsf@mouse.gnus.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: blaine.gmane.org; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:195.159.176.226"; logging-data="14119"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@blaine.gmane.org" Cc: 33383@debbugs.gnu.org To: Lars Ingebrigtsen Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Jul 10 16:33:02 2019 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1hlDeS-0003IS-LC for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; 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Wed, 10 Jul 2019 14:28:35 GMT Original-Received: from aserv0121.oracle.com (aserv0121.oracle.com [141.146.126.235]) by userp3020.oracle.com with ESMTP id 2tnc8sw42n-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 10 Jul 2019 14:28:35 +0000 Original-Received: from abhmp0012.oracle.com (abhmp0012.oracle.com [141.146.116.18]) by aserv0121.oracle.com (8.14.4/8.13.8) with ESMTP id x6AESXDN027561; Wed, 10 Jul 2019 14:28:33 GMT In-Reply-To: <87ftne5adh.fsf@mouse.gnus.org> X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Oracle Beehive Extensions for Outlook 2.0.1.9.1 (1003210) [OL 16.0.4861.0 (x86)] X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=nai engine=6000 definitions=9313 signatures=668688 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 suspectscore=0 malwarescore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 mlxscore=0 mlxlogscore=952 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.0.1-1810050000 definitions=main-1907100167 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=nai engine=6000 definitions=9313 signatures=668688 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 priorityscore=1501 malwarescore=0 suspectscore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 clxscore=1011 lowpriorityscore=0 mlxscore=0 impostorscore=0 mlxlogscore=996 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.0.1-1810050000 definitions=main-1907100167 X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 209.51.188.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "bug-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:162640 Archived-At: > > Please consider a minor enhancement: Change the message from this: > > > > (count-words--message "Region" start end) to this: > > > > (count-words--message > > (if (use-region-p) "Active region" "Inactive region") > > start > > end) > > > > It's not so obvious that the report is for the region even when > > inactive, and many Emacs users will nowadays think of the region only a= s > > the active region. So if the region is inactive and they see a non-zer= o > > number they might wonder (and need to consult the doc string to > > understand). >=20 > I think this command is the wrong place to teach people about what a > region is, and how it pertains to the "active region mode" (which I > think uses unfortunate terminology, but that's a different matter). >=20 > So I'm closing this bug report. It's unfortunate that you feel that way. 1. The doc string explicitly calls this out: "(whether or not the region is active)". Why, if this is not the place to talk about it? That was added to the doc string because it was not obvious to many/most users what was going on when they saw no region highlighting. The same thing is true for `count-lines-region'. When `transient-mark-mode' came along, with the notion of "active" region and highlighting the region, its doc string added that text because of such confusion. 2. How many users these days even know that there is such a thing as an inactive region, i.e., that the region exists even when they see no highlighting of selected text? Few. Many/most users will wonder why this command tells them about a word count in "the region" when it is inactive, and they will wonder why the doc string mentions this. Fixing the message clarifies things. Do you think it confuses things? If not, what reason is there _not_ to make this minor change? Does your region make you want to also remove that text that was added to the doc string? If it makes sense to point this out in the doc string then it makes even more sense to put it in the message - which many more users will see than will see the doc string.