From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Drew Adams Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#21746: 24.5; purpose of dired-keep-marker-copy? Date: Sat, 24 Oct 2015 01:04:08 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: References: <<36360.86247.586145.22058@gargle.gargle.HOWL>> <<69182d70-1f68-4105-9f24-7bbef43e7ecb@default>> <<40607.80402.459249.22058@gargle.gargle.HOWL>> <<987d58d9-30d3-4067-a0ae-7a7722a3f2fb@default>> <<83k2qcygzk.fsf@gnu.org>> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1445673927 5938 80.91.229.3 (24 Oct 2015 08:05:27 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 24 Oct 2015 08:05:27 +0000 (UTC) Cc: winkler@gnu.org, 21746@debbugs.gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Oct 24 10:05:13 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Zptp9-0002r0-2D for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sat, 24 Oct 2015 10:05:11 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:43386 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Zptp8-0006Xl-MV for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sat, 24 Oct 2015 04:05:10 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:41385) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Zptp4-0006VG-0d for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 24 Oct 2015 04:05:07 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Zptp0-0000ta-Qj for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 24 Oct 2015 04:05:05 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.43]:44768) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Zptp0-0000tW-NT for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 24 Oct 2015 04:05:02 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Zptp0-0006PX-G4 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 24 Oct 2015 04:05:02 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Drew Adams Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sat, 24 Oct 2015 08:05:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 21746 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by 21746-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B21746.144567385724558 (code B ref 21746); Sat, 24 Oct 2015 08:05:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 21746) by debbugs.gnu.org; 24 Oct 2015 08:04:17 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:35475 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1ZptoF-0006O0-Mo for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 24 Oct 2015 04:04:16 -0400 Original-Received: from aserp1040.oracle.com ([141.146.126.69]:50952) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1ZptoB-0006Ng-Op for 21746@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 24 Oct 2015 04:04:12 -0400 Original-Received: from aserv0022.oracle.com (aserv0022.oracle.com [141.146.126.234]) by aserp1040.oracle.com (Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2/Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2) with ESMTP id t9O84A8f004206 (version=TLSv1 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 24 Oct 2015 08:04:10 GMT Original-Received: from userv0121.oracle.com (userv0121.oracle.com [156.151.31.72]) by aserv0022.oracle.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id t9O84ATJ019006 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 Oct 2015 08:04:10 GMT Original-Received: from abhmp0005.oracle.com (abhmp0005.oracle.com [141.146.116.11]) by userv0121.oracle.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id t9O849xZ014253; Sat, 24 Oct 2015 08:04:09 GMT In-Reply-To: <<83k2qcygzk.fsf@gnu.org>> X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Oracle Beehive Extensions for Outlook 2.0.1.9 (901082) [OL 12.0.6691.5000 (x86)] X-Source-IP: aserv0022.oracle.com [141.146.126.234] X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 3.x X-Received-From: 208.118.235.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:107961 Archived-At: > > > Thank you, indeed I was missing this piece of info. I am just > > > wondering: how often are you using this? Is this a feature which > > > should be exposed to all emacs beginners? If yes, it needs to be > > > documented better. > > > > There is a lot in Dired that I think should be exposed/documented > > better/more. By default we don't even load dired-x.el or > > dired-aux.el, and they provide lots of stuff useful even for > > beginners, including lots of menus. > > > > I would be in favor of our loading both of these Dired libraries > > by default. There is lots in Dired that users can benefit from, > > but they are typically unaware of it. >=20 > Aren't the commands and options there autoloaded? No. > If not, we could autoload them, which would solve the > visibility problem without bloating the minimal memory > footprint too much. Patches welcome. No, it would not solve the visibility or discoverability problem, IMO. Users are much more likely to find and use the commands and keys they provide when they are (a) in the menus and (b) documented in `C-h m'. As for the minimal footprint: dired.el is not even loaded by default (`C-x d' is autoloaded). These 3 libraries are no big deal, footprint-wise. *IF* a user chooses to use `C-x d', and thus pay the cost of loading dired.el, it is not a big deal to load the other two at the same time and get the benefit of their menu additions, keys, and commands. (IMHO.) But hey, it's been like this for 40 years. I have no problem with it continuing like this for another 40. ;-) (I use Dired+, which does load the other 2, in addition to adding more stuff to bloat the memory. ;-))