From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Jean Louis Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#61325: 30.0.50; Jokes in GNUS manual Date: Wed, 8 Mar 2023 08:34:38 +0300 Message-ID: References: <873577570z.fsf@localhost> <875yc2s89n.fsf@yahoo.com> <87h6vkbgot.fsf@localhost> <87mt5aj626.fsf@localhost> <87cz65hkk1.fsf@yahoo.com> <87cz5kfza6.fsf@localhost> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="33102"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Mutt/2.2.9+54 (af2080d) (2022-11-21) Cc: luangruo@yahoo.com, Gregory Heytings , Richard Stallman , 61325@debbugs.gnu.org, stefankangas@gmail.com To: Ihor Radchenko Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Wed Mar 08 06:38:32 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1pZmVS-0008PB-BM for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 08 Mar 2023 06:38:30 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pZmV2-0007HP-Us; Wed, 08 Mar 2023 00:38:04 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pZmV0-0007HB-O2 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 08 Mar 2023 00:38:02 -0500 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.43]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pZmV0-0005UP-8X for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 08 Mar 2023 00:38:02 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1pZmUz-0005cw-T4 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 08 Mar 2023 00:38:01 -0500 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Jean Louis Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Wed, 08 Mar 2023 05:38:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 61325 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs Original-Received: via spool by 61325-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B61325.167825384121575 (code B ref 61325); Wed, 08 Mar 2023 05:38:01 +0000 Original-Received: (at 61325) by debbugs.gnu.org; 8 Mar 2023 05:37:21 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47658 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1pZmUK-0005bv-Pv for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 08 Mar 2023 00:37:21 -0500 Original-Received: from stw1.rcdrun.com ([217.170.207.13]:55531) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1pZmUI-0005bm-KI for 61325@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 08 Mar 2023 00:37:19 -0500 Original-Received: from localhost ([::ffff:197.239.40.20]) (AUTH: PLAIN admin, TLS: TLS1.3,256bits,ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) by stw1.rcdrun.com with ESMTPSA id 0000000000103956.0000000064081F0F.00007287; Tue, 07 Mar 2023 22:37:19 -0700 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <87cz5kfza6.fsf@localhost> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:257513 Archived-At: * Ihor Radchenko [2023-03-07 16:49]: > The problem with Gnus manual though is that the number of jokes in it is > huge. And it appears that jokes involving sensitive topics are not > occasional. Statements are too hypothetical, they are making the problem, creating the problem where there was none in reality. And participants, IMHO, are acting highly hypothetically, trying to judge public opinion without really asking public. Public relation is about relation to public in plural, and you don't have that. We heard of anonymous Muslim offended by what? Some sex jokes? How about first complaining to his country's censorship department, as they are responsible in the first place to let those offending words pass through their censorship filters (irony). Before deciding which joke is appropriate or not or what shall be removed, one shall ask minimum of 1000 public members. And I believe participants don't have resources for that, but many like to act as "public relation officers" by knowing it all how some people would feel. There was no real problem. No law broken, nobody was harmed, and there was no incident of real user trying to use Gnus, only hypothetical assumptions, no facts. The real problem could be when specific, named, non-anonymous user says that user did not understand part of the manual, and does not know how to use Gnus, but wants to connect to (G)news. Real problem could be also when there would be continuous non-anonymous complaints on those jokes in last 2 decades. -- Jean Take action in Free Software Foundation campaigns: https://www.fsf.org/campaigns In support of Richard M. Stallman https://stallmansupport.org/