From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Richard M Stallman Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#631: the M- notation suggestion Date: Wed, 30 Jul 2008 21:59:39 -0400 Message-ID: References: Reply-To: rms@gnu.org, 631@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-15 X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1217471261 3193 80.91.229.12 (31 Jul 2008 02:27:41 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 02:27:41 +0000 (UTC) Cc: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org To: xah lee Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Jul 31 04:28:30 2008 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1KONtz-0003HK-Sl for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Thu, 31 Jul 2008 04:28:28 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56155 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1KONt5-0000nS-Eq for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 22:27:31 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1KONsz-0000ld-M3 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 22:27:25 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1KONsy-0000jy-6l for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 22:27:25 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=52199 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1KONsy-0000jv-0K for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 22:27:24 -0400 Original-Received: from rzlab.ucr.edu ([138.23.92.77]:56097) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS-1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1KONsx-0004VP-SD for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 22:27:24 -0400 Original-Received: from rzlab.ucr.edu (rzlab.ucr.edu [127.0.0.1]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.13.8/8.13.8/Debian-3) with ESMTP id m6V2RLZL024564; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 19:27:21 -0700 Original-Received: (from debbugs@localhost) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.13.8/8.13.8/Submit) id m6V2A4Wc019699; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 19:10:04 -0700 X-Loop: don@donarmstrong.com Resent-From: Richard M Stallman Resent-To: bug-submit-list@donarmstrong.com Resent-CC: Emacs Bugs Resent-Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 02:10:04 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: don@donarmstrong.com X-Emacs-PR-Message: report 631 X-Emacs-PR-Package: emacs X-Emacs-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by submit@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com id=B.121746963817461 (code B ref -1); Thu, 31 Jul 2008 02:10:04 +0000 Original-Received: (at submit) by emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; 31 Jul 2008 02:00:38 +0000 Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [199.232.76.165]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.13.8/8.13.8/Debian-3) with ESMTP id m6V20ZXl017370 for ; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 19:00:36 -0700 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1KONT1-0007YT-En for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 22:00:35 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1KONT0-0007Y5-RL for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 22:00:35 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=58155 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1KONT0-0007Xy-K6 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 22:00:34 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([140.186.70.10]:38010) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1KONT0-0001iB-59 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 22:00:34 -0400 Original-Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1KONS7-0006Yc-SW; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 21:59:39 -0400 In-reply-to: (message from xah lee on Wed, 30 Jul 2008 01:49:01 -0700) X-detected-kernel: by monty-python.gnu.org: Linux 2.6, seldom 2.4 (older, 4) X-detected-kernel: by monty-python.gnu.org: Linux 2.6 (newer, 3) Resent-Date: Wed, 30 Jul 2008 22:27:25 -0400 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:18933 Archived-At: The Alt+?key? or Ctrl+?key? notation is universal among Windows and Linux. I think you mean "GNU/Linux". Linux has no user interface and its documentation has no reason to refer to any specific keys. Our convention for the GNU system is C-x and M-x, which is what you are proposing to change. Using a notation that contains the actual label on keyboard's keys is much easier to understand. A beginning computer user, can read the ?Ctrl+?key?? notation and figure out which keys to press. There is some validity in that argument. For the Emacs Manual I have a feeling this would be very wasteful. But maybe it would be ok for some of the help commands, maybe even for all of them.