Features: Scroll wheel/ball, right bar

Features: Scroll wheel/ball, right bar

[Hans Aberg]

At least the GNU Bison list is used for feature suggestions, so here  
for Emacs:

Under Mac OS X, I use a mouse with scroll wheel, and Apple now even  
has a mouse with a scroll ball, both which are used to scroll the  
frames within a window. When I now use emacs21, from Fink (under Mac  
OS 10.4.3), I feel somewhat hampered in not being able to do that. In  
the Mac OS X X11 X Window server, uxterm (and xterm), support scroll  
both in the frame and in the scroll-bar. In xman, scroll is supported  
only in the frame (not the scroll-bar). So it would be nice and help  
up user efficiency to have such a feature.

In addition, uxterm has a -rightbar, which puts the scroll-bar to the  
right, which I am Mac user is used to. Now, I think that might even  
have a -bothbar option, putting a scroll-bar both left and right, as  
there is a principle that efficiency in work is inversely  
proportional to the time it takes to move the pointer to the area of  
action. One could then choose the bar that is closest to the pointer.

   Hans Aberg

Re: Features: Scroll wheel/ball, right bar

[Richard M. Stallman]

Please try the development Emacs from CVS on savannah.gnu.org
and see if it handles this.  It does have support for "mouse wheels".

Re: Features: Scroll wheel/ball, right bar

[Hans Aberg]

On 7 Dec 2005, at 18:06, Richard M. Stallman wrote:

> Please try the development Emacs from CVS on savannah.gnu.org
> and see if it handles this.  It does have support for "mouse wheels".

Yes, I will report this to Fink <http://fink.sourceforge.net/>, which  
provided the emacs21 I am using. I think this Fink for Mac OS X (I  
use 10.4.3) is a very convenient install/deinstall system, that any  
causal user can use, which perhaps GNU should have a look at, to  
spread its software even further to users. It serves only as a  
complement to traditional UNIX installs, though. But I found it very  
good that I can quickly take down a binary automatically tailored to  
my computer to check the software out, then move ahead with compiling  
it myself within Fink if I so like, and then perhaps take down a  
latest or CVS version of the program for a traditional home directory  
or /usr/local/ installation. So I might try to compile the CVS  
version later -- CVS works just fine under Mac OS 10.4.3, and I had  
to do that with the Flex version of which only the CVS version would  
compile correctly under BSD. But Mac OS X support for X Window is not  
yet complete, which staves me off a bit.

While at it, there is are also some Mac OS X/Emacs interaction  
issues, which may not belong to Emacs, but might be worth being aware  
of: The Mac OS X X11 xterm/uxterm versions support Mac OS X copy/ 
paste, which Emacs doesn't. One can get around this, by using X  
Window copy/paste into xterm/uxterm, but it is somewhat unnatural.

Second, the Emacs Meta key and the Mac OS X Command key use the same  
keyboard clover key, with the latter having precedence over the  
former if both are in use. The Mac OS X does not have many Command  
keys, so clashes are relatively rare. But when it is happens, it is  
an inconvenience. One can get around this problem by turning off the  
Mac Command key, but again, this is not natural for Mac users. The  
question is though finding a more convenient workaround: Perhaps  
persuading Apple admitting left/right clover be mapped differently,  
to Command/Meta (I may drop them a note). Or perhaps some Emacs hack,  
in the wait, which might be long. :-)

   Hans Aberg

Re: Features: Scroll wheel/ball, right bar

[Richard M. Stallman]

I am not interested personally in MacOS support--it is a non-free
operating system.  There are some others who are, so maybe they will
look at your suggestions.

Re: Features: Scroll wheel/ball, right bar

[Hans Aberg]

On 8 Dec 2005, at 05:53, Richard M. Stallman wrote:

> I am not interested personally in MacOS support--it is a non-free
> operating system.

It was only mentioned as input, not asking for support. :-)

> There are some others who are, so maybe they will
> look at your suggestions.

I have dropped off a suggest at the Apple developers site about the  
Meta/Command key issue, where it is most likely best resolved, and  
also mentioned that emacs CVS now supports scroll, though it will  
probably more likely be up to the Fink package developers to do it.  
Apple does not currently not officially support UNIX or X Window, but  
I figure they soon will have to, in view of that it is an attraction  
among users.

   Hans Aberg