From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Ioannis Kappas Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#57880: 28.1; Emacs crashes with native compilation on when some antivirus program is running on MS-Windows Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2022 07:55:03 +0100 Message-ID: References: <83o7v9ugv2.fsf@gnu.org> <83czbnud9d.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="11828"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: 57880@debbugs.gnu.org, akrl@sdf.org To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Thu Sep 22 09:09:39 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1obGL4-0002xE-KB for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; 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a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date; bh=C3SZrahwpK+9XyveDULwpIbfgwhJbNj8PG6fgMkLKSs=; b=CW7Ju4JBOGqWOyvbXFIpX5zSkrUxQtuX3OWUq/XQ0Qw+6UHTaaV3HhySsIjE0wi8eo x5ouEzWG2tuoq/jQoFc/Y/OVPJEmorlvjcjgr7Ilj9rNTGrNeuFcnDimY4VWH5VPSpKr f9gBgJIvrgsCsN4Rqrs/OOYXePnEBstoGyRoAtYSqrDzW362oV1mnpoziZO8BOUdC/H6 i6bwzGHIZvi4iCDooK2JPIoqRuan1RYjof8/1XXh+bt4gNpVZvuoSFXwK2gK/AWdf/BW W+DKXAyvTbaci09RU3qMJMg6GOvMg2+hdd3FXDiDEhZYJM6/0PeLjw9rnKwqxnnobEsS OXUA== X-Gm-Message-State: ACrzQf247WOVMI/lYqymWIA9E70cKXqXiWBC5a0gkmdkpY7NpI84hv4H xS0Udwfjqhl4oL/Ef8vz8JVismiD6BVOT5B1eg8= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AMsMyM7RwJ693YlMl9UPI8OfMDLk5QLLtqXAlVx7kO2ta4Gs2rF/MUKMtp2RVSIE7aNmNtfpkDR9NKoY1THh9XPnMBk= X-Received: by 2002:a05:600c:3c8e:b0:3b4:d224:addf with SMTP id bg14-20020a05600c3c8e00b003b4d224addfmr8279559wmb.132.1663829714040; Wed, 21 Sep 2022 23:55:14 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <83czbnud9d.fsf@gnu.org> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "bug-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:243400 Archived-At: Hi Eli On Thu, Sep 22, 2022 at 7:36 AM Eli Zaretskii wrote: > How can an average user go about researching this? They'd need a > debugger, a binary with debug info, and probably also a way of > compiling Emacs. That doesn't sound like a typical Windows user to > me. There will get a lot of "eln file inconsistent with current runtime" messages in Emacs warnings buffer, the users will search on the Internet, and they eventually notice this discussion, mentioning the possible workarounds. > When Emacs crashes, they will report a bug, or ask on some forum. We > can have this issue and its solutions described in PROBLEMS, so we > could point them to that place. If Emacs just crashes with not the slightest indication what has gone wrong, they have to go through a bug report, of which the average user won't do. > We could even mention this in the > README that accompanies the Windows binaries (if we believe users > actually read that). One way or another, if this issue happens > frequently, the information will spread widely enough for people to be > able to find it by a simple Internet search. There is always the possibility this issue happens frequently but there are no reports, users then just move one with other tooling, which means the user base is reduced. > Btw, which antivirus software have this "feature"? If it's widely > used, perhaps the "official" Emacs binaries should not be distributed > with native-compilation enabled at all? Or could there be an early init option to bypass the native compilation. This way the users can test the issue with is native comp. > > And I can see two ways going forward: > > 1. Take a step back and switch off native compilation (but how to do this > > other than recompiling Emacs?) > > 2. Stil use native compilation but change the destination .eln directory > > to a safer path, so that they can still rip the benefit. I'd expect the AV > > only have a limited set of dirs preventing GetProcAddress of > > operating, otherwise nothing would work. > > Why does the directory where the *.eln files live matter? Doesn't the > antivirus software check any loading of any DLL from anywhere on the > system? Perhaps it only matters for the User directory. AVs want to put more stricter control on the binaries the user downloads and installs themselves. > In any case, the *.eln files have at least two places on any system, > and only one of them can be changed, the other one is fixed by the > build. Those precompiled with Emacs are fine in this use case since they are not stored in the Users directory, it's only newly compiled files that exhibit this issue because they store the .eln files in the user dir by default. Thanks