From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: =?UTF-8?Q?Jo=C3=A3o_?= =?UTF-8?Q?T=C3=A1vora?= Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#14380: [gmane.emacs.bugs] bug#14380: 24.3; `network-stream-open-tls' fails in some imap servers on w32 Date: Sat, 18 May 2013 14:05:47 +0100 Message-ID: References: <87k3mw79iv.fsf@lifelogs.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1368882413 13410 80.91.229.3 (18 May 2013 13:06:53 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 18 May 2013 13:06:53 +0000 (UTC) Cc: 14380@debbugs.gnu.org To: Ted Zlatanov Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat May 18 15:06:51 2013 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1UdgqW-0005qL-5j for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sat, 18 May 2013 15:06:48 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:55406 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1UdgqV-0007GW-MK for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sat, 18 May 2013 09:06:47 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:33086) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1UdgqQ-0007GB-Jz for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 18 May 2013 09:06:45 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1UdgqP-0003U9-Ho for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 18 May 2013 09:06:42 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.43]:33526) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1UdgqP-0003U5-EV for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 18 May 2013 09:06:41 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1Udgqj-0006Yj-N1; Sat, 18 May 2013 09:07:01 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: =?UTF-8?Q?Jo=C3=A3o_?= =?UTF-8?Q?T=C3=A1vora?= Original-Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org, bugs@gnus.org Resent-Date: Sat, 18 May 2013 13:07:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 14380 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs,gnus X-GNU-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by 14380-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B14380.136888239925171 (code B ref 14380); Sat, 18 May 2013 13:07:01 +0000 Original-Received: (at 14380) by debbugs.gnu.org; 18 May 2013 13:06:39 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:50116 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1UdgqM-0006Xv-KH for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 18 May 2013 09:06:39 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-pa0-f54.google.com ([209.85.220.54]:57850) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1UdgqI-0006XN-SS for 14380@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 18 May 2013 09:06:36 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-pa0-f54.google.com with SMTP id kx1so4371188pab.41 for <14380@debbugs.gnu.org>; Sat, 18 May 2013 06:06:07 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id :subject:to:cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=ElXaJKesF1raqvvr2AkoOkB+kQgP+pUnPv8lbwPbXDc=; b=EhydpjNyEF7fLWfeUktSRUpYD9vopjxdVa9SSFxK6PmSb3a3D+57cTBMGcBwLdQuSj b8P1Ff1m8eWSYnfESVvz9b0SA8JyJqXWszP+DsVfjGFX+2yO7pgEfPZWWex4SF+VC8Je PYVcIfOniAgILmvFUbtWBbucbsmTQVdjirLRpFEJTFt4vLe/jaQqy59rBMpczCzgch+X v4l4ds+9FP2ZQ0//9nmuc5oliSZagRCZ+fqemxuPGo9d6dG8QSWSFnLuVYHir0BGjim8 HknEBHo6HcGGA67ngiSb6w7ZOCVGHBgjdx2O4Mfdq7aGYJNqCPYXkoDfnaFdco9mFVAa wqaw== X-Received: by 10.68.113.101 with SMTP id ix5mr53088658pbb.142.1368882367308; Sat, 18 May 2013 06:06:07 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: by 10.68.219.137 with HTTP; Sat, 18 May 2013 06:05:47 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <87k3mw79iv.fsf@lifelogs.com> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6.x X-Received-From: 140.186.70.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:74393 Archived-At: On Sat, May 18, 2013 at 1:33 PM, Ted Zlatanov wrote: > Sorry, I forgot to CC the two of you and the post just went to the bug > list. I didn't know if you'd see it so this is just a courtesy CC. > > Ted > > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: Ted Zlatanov > To: 14380@debbugs.gnu.org > Cc: > Date: Fri, 17 May 2013 09:12:05 -0400 > Subject: bug#14380: 24.3; `network-stream-open-tls' fails in some imap se= rvers on w32 > On Fri, 10 May 2013 21:44:12 +0100 Jo=E3o T=E1vora = wrote: > > JT> Honestly I thought builtin tls was some kind of tls library in elisp. > JT> Needing external libraries doesn't make it very builtin :-), but > JT> that's just my opinion. > > Implementing TLS in ELisp is possible, sure, but it would be extremely > slow and there's considerable risk in reimplementing that protocol. We > chose to use GnuTLS instead, which is a fast reliable C implementation > and is available for W32 and all our other platforms. lol, I wasn't suggesting implementing it in elisp at all, I just read built-in and assumed in was either statically linked in C or elisp. The point it that needing external libraries which are not always bundled doesn't make it very "builtin". But naming things, along with cache invalidation, is a a hard problem in programming :-) > I've seen dozens of bugs related to "almost working" external TLS > binaries on all platforms. Yes, but have you looked closely at this particular one? The point is rathe= r to increase robustness. That is, `open-tls-stream` could/should promise to cleanup the process buffer of its handshake garbage, so that future functions that use that resource don't see it and don't get confused by it. I'm assuming they don't need to see it, I might be wrong. But if I'm right and that fix is performed then you've effectively extended "imap just works" the set of W32 emacs users who type "M-x gnus" on a vanilla emacs in a system with some cygwin installation in PATH. Maybe it's a small set but I'm in it (when I'm at work). > GnuTLS integration with Emacs. My vote is to require GnuTLS with Emacs > and to only support it, but there are some questions there, mainly for > W32 and Mac OS X: do we auto-update GnuTLS? What happens when the > GnuTLS we install conflicts with another system install? And so on... That's all fine, I guess. I vote for that too :-) Thanks, Jo=E3o