From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Stefan Kangas Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#46627: [PATCH] Add new help command 'describe-command' Date: Fri, 19 Feb 2021 11:42:50 -0600 Message-ID: References: <835z2o4fes.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="00000000000035885b05bbb3fb95" Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="8855"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Lars Ingebrigtsen , 46627@debbugs.gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Fri Feb 19 18:56:52 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1lDA1M-0002Br-M9 for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 19 Feb 2021 18:56:52 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:48704 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lDA1L-0004un-IZ for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 19 Feb 2021 12:56:51 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:50618) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lD9ow-0007lh-2z for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 19 Feb 2021 12:44:02 -0500 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.43]:38773) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lD9ov-0007E5-Ok for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 19 Feb 2021 12:44:01 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lD9ov-0001f1-Lt for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 19 Feb 2021 12:44:01 -0500 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Stefan Kangas Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Fri, 19 Feb 2021 17:44:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 46627 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: patch Original-Received: via spool by 46627-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B46627.16137565836300 (code B ref 46627); Fri, 19 Feb 2021 17:44:01 +0000 Original-Received: (at 46627) by debbugs.gnu.org; 19 Feb 2021 17:43:03 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:50319 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lD9nz-0001dY-43 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 19 Feb 2021 12:43:03 -0500 Original-Received: from mail-pg1-f182.google.com ([209.85.215.182]:37088) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lD9nt-0001cz-FH for 46627@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 19 Feb 2021 12:43:01 -0500 Original-Received: by mail-pg1-f182.google.com with SMTP id j1so1795443pgh.4 for <46627@debbugs.gnu.org>; Fri, 19 Feb 2021 09:42:57 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=WrMm+ozH3XeHOiuEPBsp6zwrFbJKXTYGNgHFDYZ6yi4=; b=FQdG560HZU+SGVtgb3drFCtXTqPMECK9b7FUkHwtedh32KYKvI3wKIq0Dss/+nrKRb Qb19MOn7TQ364+QwGYHXxa6zihR4JC82ci27I3dEgwnJnYCR17C25BNv+PV7D4YewFBj AkWK/G5VFAm3AFrTpy5WA4Effs3luaZ5xj7HPOVZkyhKwZiiiA41hcrwMZ07qPblwLYt jg7jsLDzxVNp3oi/6WtJtvbFb15TARiVESwY8SXGRENB2wmR6TuFZOtuRKA9l8/lOULk MqBYonHdztPiQQEbZ7Ky0R6clbFbqtxxWnZac50A8Yo8VzcbSFpapZR+WDrqQOnH+2/o UG8A== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533Vl1Mso6PpnlQknSBrehJGwSHt+udcZT2opudDnPgleQzBWqJH 1e/OWzqSEmCJoq5YjAEusIKIK1rM+g6ZAazSLQA= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxGAaZdEfjMhtDEQmgeB4Ya5g0uNK5hSvL+3xFo1i1yKAs9tUH1b7CWmm4cth6NS5T6EowVptT5d50Q+86mV9A= X-Received: by 2002:a63:6384:: with SMTP id x126mr9324239pgb.345.1613756571675; Fri, 19 Feb 2021 09:42:51 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: from 753933720722 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Fri, 19 Feb 2021 11:42:50 -0600 In-Reply-To: <835z2o4fes.fsf@gnu.org> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "bug-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:200369 Archived-At: --00000000000035885b05bbb3fb95 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Eli Zaretskii writes: >> As recently discussed on emacs-devel, it could be useful to have a >> command `describe-command' to search for commands. Please find attached >> a patch that adds such a command. > > Thanks, but please also include the necessary updates for the user > manual, and perhaps also the tutorial. The Help menu should probably > also have this. OK, I have written the documentation, updated the help screen and tutorial, and added a menu entry. It would be good if someone could look it over and see that it reads okay and makes sense. The way I add it in the documentation treats it as more basic than `C-h f'. That is, the proposed text first describes how to find documentation for commands, and only then describes how to find documentation for any Lisp function. It is the most reasonable way to do it here, I think; this is after all the "user" manual and not the "Elisp" manual. I also went ahead and added the keybinding `C-h x'. It seemed strange to not have one for a basic help command such as this. It would of course have been less work to just tack it on the existing documentation, but I took some care here to rewrite it slightly in a way that I believe will be better in the long-run. The exercise of documenting this, and thinking about how this new command fits in, has made me realize that while having a keybinding for this is useful, and `C-h x' is the best free one we have, putting it there and not on `C-h c' is rather unfortunate. (The mnemonic `M-x' feels forced and artificial.) It really is more than a little tempting to propose replacing the long-standing keybinding for `describe-key-briefly' with the new `describe-command'. But I am well aware of how hard it is to get consensus around such changes, especially with a new command. (And once it is no longer new, it is of course even harder to get it changed... and around it goes.) So, barring that, we could perhaps turn the entire argument around 180 degrees: precisely because the keybinding is so bad, it should *not* be recommended in the TUTORIAL above `C-h f', and the right thing is consequently not to give it a strong spotlight but to simply have it "tacked on", like the after-thought it is, right after our trusty old `C-h f'. And perhaps we should not give it a default keybinding either, if there is to be any hope for it to push out `describe-key-briefly' in the future... So yeah, the patch is attached, but I'm still rather undecided on what's best here. Thoughts? --00000000000035885b05bbb3fb95 Content-Type: text/x-diff; charset="US-ASCII"; name="0001-Add-new-help-command-describe-command.patch" Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="0001-Add-new-help-command-describe-command.patch" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 X-Attachment-Id: bef19ed196d77443_0.1 RnJvbSA0ZTM2ZDllMmYyNmQ2ZDQ5MGIwMzdiOWY1ZWM3ZDA4NDAyNDc5YzA4IE1vbiBTZXAgMTcg MDA6MDA6MDAgMjAwMQpGcm9tOiBTdGVmYW4gS2FuZ2FzIDxzdGVmYW5AbWFyeGlzdC5zZT4KRGF0 ZTogRnJpLCAxOSBGZWIgMjAyMSAxODoyMToyMyArMDEwMApTdWJqZWN0OiBbUEFUQ0hdIEFkZCBu ZXcgaGVscCBjb21tYW5kICdkZXNjcmliZS1jb21tYW5kJwoKKiBsaXNwL2hlbHAtZm5zLmVsIChk ZXNjcmliZS1jb21tYW5kKTogTmV3IGNvbW1hbmQuCihoZWxwLWZucy0tZGVzY3JpYmUtZnVuY3Rp b24tb3ItY29tbWFuZC1wcm9tcHQpOiBOZXcgaGVscGVyCmZ1bmN0aW9uIHRvIHByb21wdCBmb3Ig YSBmdW5jdGlvbiBvciBmdW5jdGlvbi4KKGRlc2NyaWJlLWZ1bmN0aW9uKTogVXNlIGFib3ZlIG5l dyBoZWxwZXIgZnVuY3Rpb24uCgoqIGxpc3AvaGVscC5lbCAoaGVscC1tYXApOiBCaW5kIGFib3Zl 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