From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Drew Adams" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#3438: please make line-move-visual nil Date: Mon, 1 Jun 2009 11:26:58 -0700 Message-ID: References: <87eiue83i7.fsf@cyd.mit.edu><87my92dmdt.fsf@cyd.mit.edu><87eiudewtq.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <831vqdubqy.fsf@gnu.org><6161f3180905270548t3012bc1ah161719ae01db0fb5@mail.gmail.com><5f0ff9220906010736paad9321td86fd52326ebe722@mail.gmail.com> <87oct7sur8.fsf@cyd.mit.edu> Reply-To: Drew Adams , 3438@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1243913090 30253 80.91.229.12 (2 Jun 2009 03:24:50 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2009 03:24:50 +0000 (UTC) Cc: 3438@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com, "'T.V. Raman'" , emacs-devel@gnu.org, 'ishikawa' , ams@gnu.org, stephen@xemacs.org To: "'Chong Yidong'" Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Jun 02 05:24:46 2009 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1MBKcG-00042z-7X for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Tue, 02 Jun 2009 05:24:44 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:55182 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1MBKcF-0004Ji-JC for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Mon, 01 Jun 2009 23:24:43 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1MBCNx-0000Nc-TG for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 01 Jun 2009 14:37:25 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1MBCNu-0000Jj-9h for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 01 Jun 2009 14:37:25 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=44413 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1MBCNt-0000JZ-SI for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 01 Jun 2009 14:37:21 -0400 Original-Received: from rzlab.ucr.edu ([138.23.92.77]:44146) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS-1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1MBCNs-0007Zy-TK for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 01 Jun 2009 14:37:21 -0400 Original-Received: from rzlab.ucr.edu (rzlab.ucr.edu [127.0.0.1]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id n51IbHqP003485; Mon, 1 Jun 2009 11:37:18 -0700 Original-Received: (from debbugs@localhost) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Submit) id n51IU4gd001771; Mon, 1 Jun 2009 11:30:04 -0700 X-Loop: owner@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com Resent-From: "Drew Adams" Resent-To: bug-submit-list@donarmstrong.com Resent-CC: Emacs Bugs Resent-Date: Mon, 01 Jun 2009 18:30:04 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: owner@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com X-Emacs-PR-Message: followup 3438 X-Emacs-PR-Package: emacs X-Emacs-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by 3438-submit@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com id=B3438.12438808221549 (code B ref 3438); Mon, 01 Jun 2009 18:30:04 +0000 Original-Received: (at 3438) by emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; 1 Jun 2009 18:27:02 +0000 X-Spam-Bayes: score:0.5 Bayes not run. spammytokens:Tokens not available. hammytokens:Tokens not available. Original-Received: from rgminet12.oracle.com (rcsinet12.oracle.com [148.87.113.124]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id n51IQvH0001538 for <3438@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com>; Mon, 1 Jun 2009 11:26:58 -0700 Original-Received: from acsinet15.oracle.com (acsinet15.oracle.com [141.146.126.227]) by rgminet12.oracle.com (Switch-3.3.1/Switch-3.3.1) with ESMTP id n51IQYkh009678 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 1 Jun 2009 18:26:39 GMT Original-Received: from abhmt010.oracle.com (abhmt010.oracle.com [141.146.116.19]) by acsinet15.oracle.com (Switch-3.3.1/Switch-3.3.1) with ESMTP id n51IReYP003880; Mon, 1 Jun 2009 18:27:40 GMT Original-Received: from dradamslap1 (/141.144.65.100) by default (Oracle Beehive Gateway v4.0) with ESMTP ; Mon, 01 Jun 2009 11:26:42 -0700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 In-Reply-To: <87oct7sur8.fsf@cyd.mit.edu> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Thread-Index: Acni4lAIZ9NHBJFgTwaZcuGXYblWDAAAHlbA X-Source-IP: abhmt010.oracle.com [141.146.116.19] X-Auth-Type: Internal IP X-CT-RefId: str=0001.0A090201.4A241D64.017F:SCFSTAT5015188,ss=1,fgs=0 X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) Resent-Date: Mon, 01 Jun 2009 14:37:25 -0400 X-Mailman-Approved-At: Mon, 01 Jun 2009 23:24:11 -0400 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:28427 Archived-At: > > Please see bug report #3438. All of it is worth reading in > > this regard. Note in particular his request to have a > > buffer-local value for line-move-visual, and to have Dired > > use nil for this. > > >> In dired mode, when the cursor is near the beginning of a very long > >> filename (as in near the "AaAaAa..." below , I can't move > >> down to the next file by "n" or "cursor down" key anymore(!). > > In Dired, and call dired-previous-line and > dired-next-line, which should not be affected by line-move-visual. > I have not been able to reproduce the reported problem (i.e., > getting point stuck in Dired). Maybe the reporter has some unusual > customizations that are getting in the way. Ah, you're right. And I even remember that I started to mention Dired as an example of a formatted buffer in my original post in this thread, and removed it when I realized this was in fact the case (I used Info and Buffer List as examples). But I forgot about it when I saw the bug report. Thx. Dired is an exception in this regard among formatted buffers, so you are correct that Dired's bindings make it irrelevant for the immediate question. It does illustrate the general idea, however: line movement in formatted buffers is often different (should often be different) than it is in free-form text buffers. In Dired, it is particularly different, since we want point to stay on the file name - we constrain it to one column for vertical movement. IOW, Dired has its own buffer-local behavior for line movement, which is even more reflective of the buffer formatting than usual. If anything, this strengthens the argument for buffer-specific line movement, rather than weakening it. More typically (in formatted buffers), we want to reflect the use of newlines (they are positioned intentionally) and maintain the current column for line movement, but there is no single, privileged column (e.g. file name) that we want to constrain point to, as there is in Dired. Each formatted buffer could individually define its own line-movement commands, which amounts to just binding `line-move-visual' to nil around a call to `next-line'. But that would be a bit silly. Better to just let the variable be buffer-local. And provide nil as the default value for most formatted buffers. -- BTW, you didn't answer the questions about the poll. How's it coming along? Where is it?