From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Lars Ingebrigtsen Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#57907: 29.0.50; Using keywords with cl-loop Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2022 10:06:12 +0200 Message-ID: <87pmfryeiz.fsf@gnus.org> References: <87tu54dh3t.fsf@posteo.net> <87wna027sr.fsf@gnus.org> <87leqgdfz1.fsf@posteo.net> <87sfko2702.fsf@gnus.org> <874jx46eat.fsf@posteo.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="6138"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) Cc: 57907@debbugs.gnu.org To: Philip Kaludercic Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Mon Sep 19 10:27:39 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1oaC7u-0001Ph-BS for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; 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Original-Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=joga) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1oaBnA-000702-SY; Mon, 19 Sep 2022 10:06:14 +0200 In-Reply-To: <874jx46eat.fsf@posteo.net> (Philip Kaludercic's message of "Sun, 18 Sep 2022 12:46:18 +0000") Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwBAMAAAClLOS0AAAABGdBTUEAALGPC/xhBQAAACBj SFJNAAB6JgAAgIQAAPoAAACA6AAAdTAAAOpgAAA6mAAAF3CculE8AAAALVBMVEXu7u3Y0NfGoK/P NkTdV2e3rsuZeYdLOkUTBw9kV14nEhlLJio2IiosGiP////Zf5E1AAAAAWJLR0QOb70wTwAAAAd0 SU1FB+YJEwcsIERlldwAAAGOSURBVDjLrdK9TsJQFAfwYuJOE0kMkcHi4iq+AKUvwEA0xBV4Az4S WeV4oaNCBRcXLhe7Yk2ZhVSZ+xH6LrYF1J7WxMH/eH+959xzeznuKzz330nyPJ8Mr2Rzu5xtlxKC kD+RxKzkJ3cuSTvYE0VRkIRsTioUQju2OZB2yf/xPIlU9ZjfJAz7NbgpBSkiOJ0+xUPfaFXiIKUs G9/wY/pU8aESX6o0qsSXKtUqA9tbr96F4aLfrw5pS2nDbRjKzKR2GwAIgittDJN5DJTpmKrUA1zq EkyHAIlC2V3QWDj6WPt1SBRc1weg0R0r73tCZQwZdwlkOKXgIDhULZnN3y2QEaQpdHVdN2J6LLtz XVcdhnuoBmGMMAtDmvjDgRPZkWZTzYOXXhTWj8DgTXUjwEYe2E0jCg2v1HNzjU/F4BpkCosOBkJW /t3OiMmF3lWGBceFWdPGpZh35xQmA9wcZOIPYtcioAalVKWDwSLBr62bGOgGXhuoOQSPCmCi/ALd ezygBsw3gqGnseBhkTrHfQIpVOojvKi+iAAAACV0RVh0ZGF0ZTpjcmVhdGUAMjAyMi0wOS0xOVQw Nzo0NDozMiswMDowMHsDNFgAAAAldEVYdGRhdGU6bW9kaWZ5ADIwMjItMDktMTlUMDc6NDQ6MzIr MDA6MDAKXozkAAAAAElFTkSuQmCC X-Now-Playing: Anne Clark's _Hopeless Cases_: "Now" X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "bug-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:243044 Archived-At: Philip Kaludercic writes: > I phrased that clumsily -- while it is a new language, it doesn't always > have to feel like one. And I'm saying that that feeling is a misleading feeling -- we're leading the users down the garden path. > E.g. the repeat-collect example I gave before. > If you *can* use keywords, you *can* make some cl-loop invocations > appear to be a macro or a function call with keyword-arguments. > > But of course this wouldn't be the case, as the macro should stay > backwards compatible. I understand that. But it means that the stated rationale for this change does the users a disservice. So I'm against extending cl-loop in this way. Gerd has explained why it works this way in Common Lisp (because CL doesn't have any other choice because that's the way the language works), but we should not shoehorn in this accident into Emacs, too.