From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Ihor Radchenko Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#61281: Double backquote expansion and ", " (was: bug#61281: =?UTF-8?Q?=E2=80=9C`?=(a \, b)=?UTF-8?Q?=E2=80=9D?= equals to =?UTF-8?Q?=E2=80=9C`?=(a . , b)=?UTF-8?Q?=E2=80=9D?=) Date: Tue, 07 Feb 2023 11:50:47 +0000 Message-ID: <87pmal8zjc.fsf@localhost> References: <87a61tgdkx.fsf@web.de> <875ycghgv1.fsf@web.de> <871qn4hfte.fsf@web.de> <87fsbju0of.fsf@web.de> <875ycfoyph.fsf@localhost> <87o7q68d84.fsf@web.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="33868"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Adam Porter , Xie Shynur , "61281@debbugs.gnu.org" <61281@debbugs.gnu.org>, Drew Adams To: Michael Heerdegen Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Tue Feb 07 12:51:28 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1pPMVT-0008Y3-IA for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Tue, 07 Feb 2023 12:51:27 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pPMV7-0005BG-3Y; Tue, 07 Feb 2023 06:51:05 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pPMV5-00059z-A3 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 07 Feb 2023 06:51:03 -0500 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.43]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pPMV4-0007PO-Ni for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 07 Feb 2023 06:51:02 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1pPMV4-0002wl-8e for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 07 Feb 2023 06:51:02 -0500 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Ihor Radchenko Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Tue, 07 Feb 2023 11:51:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 61281 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs Original-Received: via spool by 61281-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B61281.167577062111275 (code B ref 61281); Tue, 07 Feb 2023 11:51:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 61281) by debbugs.gnu.org; 7 Feb 2023 11:50:21 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51354 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1pPMUO-0002vm-Vv for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 07 Feb 2023 06:50:21 -0500 Original-Received: from mout01.posteo.de ([185.67.36.65]:60941) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1pPMUM-0002vT-UH for 61281@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 07 Feb 2023 06:50:19 -0500 Original-Received: from submission (posteo.de [185.67.36.169]) by mout01.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D0C8A240487 for <61281@debbugs.gnu.org>; Tue, 7 Feb 2023 12:50:12 +0100 (CET) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=posteo.net; s=2017; t=1675770612; bh=76lBSl7PUCd4Dv3e55+fKupjR2oYWQM4N42AyFdQ/9c=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:Date:From; b=nAACc4p40ed9pdKQ6+PUunjPE0ZU1SJI/qKHn6FsonaTDDfEDdral28nhC3rFMgkP 7yHvX56TbQi7H0DlPFfE6hcQuCA4g7UhAH5rAzjdGRhzKyw8JlTvS8bpU8RlheuZoY fkjtUTdtD4W/unTU5YYlODn1SzVcK0cody/zJzfCBa1OX9lmeb2hSh1iEc7BT4pIUK kwItR174Ifb1pGd9nD1avIT+84LtXrHHftUfwc7Kqiee+zkzBosvELE2TN1MALVVZ7 XEK8QDT6uGBSGmaeT5pqeBN772g3WAMTeQxQukEtGLdHzne+n/k6YrCPC/du6/Dhym 0X6/HyM5tekUw== Original-Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by submission (posteo.de) with ESMTPSA id 4PB1dt0CJ6z6ts8; Tue, 7 Feb 2023 12:50:08 +0100 (CET) In-Reply-To: <87o7q68d84.fsf@web.de> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:255033 Archived-At: Michael Heerdegen writes: > But this has not directly a relation to what we discuss here. If you > rewrite ,X as (\, X) you have additional ways to express the above > things, looking like (,'\, X) etc (though these are less readable). I may indeed be misunderstanding the case I raised vs. the discussed bug. Let's branch this off. > Ihor Radchenko writes: > >> I recall one user had a need to macro-expand something that indented to >> be passed to another macro-expand. We did not find a way to retain "," >> in the macro-expanded sexp. > > I guess you are describing the common difficulties related to multiple > levels of backquotes (nested backquotes). These are tricky (for human > brains) and you need to know little "tricks" to get what you want (took > me a while to discover how to deal with nested backquotes, maybe we > should have examples in the manual?). I would appreciate having such examples in the manual. Also, CCing Adam, who originally raised the question. > Anyway, you (only) need to use trivial quoting, it is not necessary and > probably not good style to use the symbol "," instead of the reader > construct in human written code. Could you elaborate? > Compare: > > #+begin_src emacs-lisp > ;; Substitution at the same place at multiple levels: > (let ((f 'my-function)) > ``(when (funcall ,,f) (do-something))) > ==> > `(when (funcall ,my-function) > (do-something)) > > ;; Substitution once, by outside level backquote: > (let ((f 'my-function)) > ``(when (funcall ,',f) (do-something))) > ==> > `(when (funcall ,'my-function) > (do-something)) > > ;; Substitution once, by the inside backquote > ``(when (funcall ,,'f) (do-something)) > ==> > `(when (funcall ,f) > (do-something)) > > or simpler: > > ``(when (funcall ,f) (do-something)) > ==> > `(when (funcall ,f) > (do-something)) > #+end_src > > You probably tried to get some of these cases work, and it's not trivial > to get to a solution the first time one encounters this problem. -- Ihor Radchenko // yantar92, Org mode contributor, Learn more about Org mode at . Support Org development at , or support my work at