* bug#72294: 29.2; Emacs --init-directory=... puts user-init-file elsewhere
@ 2024-07-25 16:12 Sean Devlin
2024-07-25 18:56 ` Eli Zaretskii
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Sean Devlin @ 2024-07-25 16:12 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: 72294
Hi folks,
Recipe:
1. emacs --init-directory=/tmp/emacs
2. M-: user-init-file RET
The user-init-file is ~/.emacs, despite the flag to use /tmp/emacs as
the init directory.
Maybe this is intended behavior, but I found it confusing. The manual
says this about the flag:
"Specify the directory to use when looking for the Emacs init files."
I interpreted this to mean all init files, including the user-init-file.
A workaround is to create /tmp/emacs/init.el before starting Emacs:
1. mkdir -p /tmp/emacs
2. touch /tmp/emacs/init.el
3. emacs --init-directory=/tmp/emacs
Thanks!
In GNU Emacs 29.2 (build 1, aarch64-apple-darwin21.6.0, NS
appkit-2113.60 Version 12.6.6 (Build 21G646)) of 2024-01-18 built on
armbob.lan
Windowing system distributor 'Apple'
System Description: macOS
Configured using:
'configure --with-ns '--enable-locallisppath=/Library/Application
Support/Emacs/${version}/site-lisp:/Library/Application
Support/Emacs/site-lisp' --with-modules 'CFLAGS=-DFD_SETSIZE=10000
-DDARWIN_UNLIMITED_SELECT' --with-x-toolkit=no'
Configured features:
ACL GLIB GMP GNUTLS JPEG JSON LIBXML2 MODULES NOTIFY KQUEUE NS PDUMPER
PNG RSVG SQLITE3 THREADS TIFF TOOLKIT_SCROLL_BARS TREE_SITTER ZLIB
Important settings:
value of $LANG: en_US.UTF-8
locale-coding-system: utf-8-unix
Major mode: Fundamental
Minor modes in effect:
tooltip-mode: t
global-eldoc-mode: t
show-paren-mode: t
electric-indent-mode: t
mouse-wheel-mode: t
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transient-mark-mode: t
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Load-path shadows:
None found.
Features:
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files window text-properties overlay sha1 md5 base64 format env
code-pages mule custom widget keymap hashtable-print-readable backquote
threads kqueue cocoa ns multi-tty make-network-process emacs)
Memory information:
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(symbols 48 5930 0)
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^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* bug#72294: 29.2; Emacs --init-directory=... puts user-init-file elsewhere
2024-07-25 16:12 bug#72294: 29.2; Emacs --init-directory=... puts user-init-file elsewhere Sean Devlin
@ 2024-07-25 18:56 ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-07-25 19:59 ` Sean Devlin
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Eli Zaretskii @ 2024-07-25 18:56 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Sean Devlin; +Cc: 72294
> From: Sean Devlin <spd@toadstyle.org>
> Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2024 12:12:07 -0400
>
> 1. emacs --init-directory=/tmp/emacs
> 2. M-: user-init-file RET
>
> The user-init-file is ~/.emacs, despite the flag to use /tmp/emacs as
> the init directory.
>
> Maybe this is intended behavior, but I found it confusing. The manual
> says this about the flag:
>
> "Specify the directory to use when looking for the Emacs init files."
>
> I interpreted this to mean all init files, including the user-init-file.
That option sets user-emacs-directory, it doesn't directly affect
user-init-file.
Emacs by default sets user-emacs-directory to the directory where it
actually finds the init file. This option overrides that.
> A workaround is to create /tmp/emacs/init.el before starting Emacs:
>
> 1. mkdir -p /tmp/emacs
> 2. touch /tmp/emacs/init.el
> 3. emacs --init-directory=/tmp/emacs
It isn't a workaround, it's how you should do it.
I don't think this is a bug. The search for init file and the setting
of user-emacs-directory that follows are complex issues, not easily
explained in a few words.
May I ask why you needed to use this option? It should not be
generally needed.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* bug#72294: 29.2; Emacs --init-directory=... puts user-init-file elsewhere
2024-07-25 18:56 ` Eli Zaretskii
@ 2024-07-25 19:59 ` Sean Devlin
2024-07-26 6:15 ` Robert Pluim
2024-07-26 6:16 ` Eli Zaretskii
0 siblings, 2 replies; 12+ messages in thread
From: Sean Devlin @ 2024-07-25 19:59 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Eli Zaretskii; +Cc: 72294
Hi,
> I don't think this is a bug.
Fair enough.
> May I ask why you needed to use this option? It should not be
> generally needed.
Lately, I run Emacs from the emacs-30 branch with some local tweaks. I
found a bug in Org, and I was trying to reproduce it in a stable version
of Emacs with default configuration. The bug is in Org 9.7+, which is
newer than what ships in Emacs 29.
Since I knew I would need to install a package, I checked the manual for
the command-line flags to specify the user-emacs-directory, and I found
the --init-directory option. I opened an instance of Emacs 29.2 with
--init-directory=/tmp/bug, and I installed Org via ELPA.
Then, for an unrelated task, I opened an instance of my main Emacs
installation, and I was surprised to see it load without any of my
configuration. I discovered the Emacs 29 instance had written a file to
~/.emacs, shadowing my own configuration in ~/.emacs.d/init.el. That it
wrote the user-init-file outside the user-emacs-directory I specified
was surprising to me.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* bug#72294: 29.2; Emacs --init-directory=... puts user-init-file elsewhere
2024-07-25 19:59 ` Sean Devlin
@ 2024-07-26 6:15 ` Robert Pluim
2024-07-26 10:34 ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-07-26 6:16 ` Eli Zaretskii
1 sibling, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Robert Pluim @ 2024-07-26 6:15 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Sean Devlin; +Cc: Eli Zaretskii, 72294
>>>>> On Thu, 25 Jul 2024 15:59:45 -0400, Sean Devlin <spd@toadstyle.org> said:
Sean> Hi,
>> I don't think this is a bug.
Sean> Fair enough.
>> May I ask why you needed to use this option? It should not be
>> generally needed.
Sean> Lately, I run Emacs from the emacs-30 branch with some local tweaks. I
Sean> found a bug in Org, and I was trying to reproduce it in a stable version
Sean> of Emacs with default configuration. The bug is in Org 9.7+, which is
Sean> newer than what ships in Emacs 29.
Sean> Since I knew I would need to install a package, I checked the manual for
Sean> the command-line flags to specify the user-emacs-directory, and I found
Sean> the --init-directory option. I opened an instance of Emacs 29.2 with
Sean> --init-directory=/tmp/bug, and I installed Org via ELPA.
The emacs info file says
‘--init-directory’
Specify the directory to use when looking for the Emacs init files.
and '.emacs' is an Emacs init file, so I guess the confusion is
understandable. Maybe we should add "(except '.emacs')" to that
statement.
Sean> Then, for an unrelated task, I opened an instance of my main Emacs
Sean> installation, and I was surprised to see it load without any of my
Sean> configuration. I discovered the Emacs 29 instance had written a file to
Sean> ~/.emacs, shadowing my own configuration in ~/.emacs.d/init.el. That it
Sean> wrote the user-init-file outside the user-emacs-directory I specified
Sean> was surprising to me.
HOME=/tmp/emacs emacs
is how I do that kind of testing.
Robert
--
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* bug#72294: 29.2; Emacs --init-directory=... puts user-init-file elsewhere
2024-07-26 6:15 ` Robert Pluim
@ 2024-07-26 10:34 ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-07-26 12:00 ` Robert Pluim
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Eli Zaretskii @ 2024-07-26 10:34 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Robert Pluim; +Cc: spd, 72294
> From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@gmail.com>
> Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>, 72294@debbugs.gnu.org
> Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2024 08:15:01 +0200
>
> >>>>> On Thu, 25 Jul 2024 15:59:45 -0400, Sean Devlin <spd@toadstyle.org> said:
>
> The emacs info file says
>
> ‘--init-directory’
> Specify the directory to use when looking for the Emacs init files.
>
> and '.emacs' is an Emacs init file, so I guess the confusion is
> understandable. Maybe we should add "(except '.emacs')" to that
> statement.
That would be inaccurate, AFAIU. If the .emacs file is there, it will
be used from that directory.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* bug#72294: 29.2; Emacs --init-directory=... puts user-init-file elsewhere
2024-07-26 10:34 ` Eli Zaretskii
@ 2024-07-26 12:00 ` Robert Pluim
2024-07-26 12:03 ` Eli Zaretskii
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Robert Pluim @ 2024-07-26 12:00 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Eli Zaretskii; +Cc: spd, 72294
>>>>> On Fri, 26 Jul 2024 13:34:07 +0300, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> said:
>> From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@gmail.com>
>> Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>, 72294@debbugs.gnu.org
>> Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2024 08:15:01 +0200
>>
>> >>>>> On Thu, 25 Jul 2024 15:59:45 -0400, Sean Devlin <spd@toadstyle.org> said:
>>
>> The emacs info file says
>>
>> ‘--init-directory’
>> Specify the directory to use when looking for the Emacs init files.
>>
>> and '.emacs' is an Emacs init file, so I guess the confusion is
>> understandable. Maybe we should add "(except '.emacs')" to that
>> statement.
Eli> That would be inaccurate, AFAIU. If the .emacs file is there, it will
Eli> be used from that directory.
Thatʼs not what I observe:
~/.emacs:
(message "Home dir")
/tmp/emacs-30/.emacs:
(message "Temp dir")
src/emacs --init-directory=/tmp/emacs-30
=> *Messages* contains "Home dir"
So it looks like this option only affects `user-emacs-directory'.
I agree it would be less confusing if it used the ".emacs" in
"/tmp/emacs-30", but I think the ship has sailed on that one.
Robert
--
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* bug#72294: 29.2; Emacs --init-directory=... puts user-init-file elsewhere
2024-07-26 12:00 ` Robert Pluim
@ 2024-07-26 12:03 ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-07-26 12:14 ` Robert Pluim
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Eli Zaretskii @ 2024-07-26 12:03 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Robert Pluim; +Cc: spd, 72294
> From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@gmail.com>
> Cc: spd@toadstyle.org, 72294@debbugs.gnu.org
> Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2024 14:00:22 +0200
>
> >>>>> On Fri, 26 Jul 2024 13:34:07 +0300, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> said:
>
> >> From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@gmail.com>
> >> Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>, 72294@debbugs.gnu.org
> >> Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2024 08:15:01 +0200
> >>
> >> >>>>> On Thu, 25 Jul 2024 15:59:45 -0400, Sean Devlin <spd@toadstyle.org> said:
> >>
> >> The emacs info file says
> >>
> >> ‘--init-directory’
> >> Specify the directory to use when looking for the Emacs init files.
> >>
> >> and '.emacs' is an Emacs init file, so I guess the confusion is
> >> understandable. Maybe we should add "(except '.emacs')" to that
> >> statement.
>
> Eli> That would be inaccurate, AFAIU. If the .emacs file is there, it will
> Eli> be used from that directory.
>
> Thatʼs not what I observe:
>
> ~/.emacs:
>
> (message "Home dir")
>
> /tmp/emacs-30/.emacs:
>
> (message "Temp dir")
>
> src/emacs --init-directory=/tmp/emacs-30
>
> => *Messages* contains "Home dir"
>
> So it looks like this option only affects `user-emacs-directory'.
Sean said that an existing init file was being used from that
directory. This contradicts your observations.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* bug#72294: 29.2; Emacs --init-directory=... puts user-init-file elsewhere
2024-07-26 12:03 ` Eli Zaretskii
@ 2024-07-26 12:14 ` Robert Pluim
2024-07-26 13:48 ` Sean Devlin
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Robert Pluim @ 2024-07-26 12:14 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Eli Zaretskii; +Cc: spd, 72294
>>>>> On Fri, 26 Jul 2024 15:03:41 +0300, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> said:
>> ~/.emacs:
>>
>> (message "Home dir")
>>
>> /tmp/emacs-30/.emacs:
>>
>> (message "Temp dir")
>>
>> src/emacs --init-directory=/tmp/emacs-30
>>
>> => *Messages* contains "Home dir"
>>
>> So it looks like this option only affects `user-emacs-directory'.
Eli> Sean said that an existing init file was being used from that
Eli> directory. This contradicts your observations.
An existing "init.el" file, if "~/.emacs" does not exist. Not a
".emacs" file in the directory specified by
'--init-directory'. Because --init-directory changes
`user-emacs-directory'.
Robert
--
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* bug#72294: 29.2; Emacs --init-directory=... puts user-init-file elsewhere
2024-07-26 12:14 ` Robert Pluim
@ 2024-07-26 13:48 ` Sean Devlin
2024-07-26 13:51 ` Robert Pluim
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Sean Devlin @ 2024-07-26 13:48 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Robert Pluim; +Cc: Eli Zaretskii, 72294
> On Jul 26, 2024, at 8:14 AM, Robert Pluim <rpluim@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>>>>> On Fri, 26 Jul 2024 15:03:41 +0300, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> said:
>
>>> ~/.emacs:
>>>
>>> (message "Home dir")
>>>
>>> /tmp/emacs-30/.emacs:
>>>
>>> (message "Temp dir")
>>>
>>> src/emacs --init-directory=/tmp/emacs-30
>>>
>>> => *Messages* contains "Home dir"
>>>
>>> So it looks like this option only affects `user-emacs-directory'.
>
> Eli> Sean said that an existing init file was being used from that
> Eli> directory. This contradicts your observations.
>
> An existing "init.el" file, if "~/.emacs" does not exist. Not a
> ".emacs" file in the directory specified by
> '--init-directory'. Because --init-directory changes
> `user-emacs-directory’.
Correct, I only tested with a file named init.el, not .emacs.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* bug#72294: 29.2; Emacs --init-directory=... puts user-init-file elsewhere
2024-07-26 13:48 ` Sean Devlin
@ 2024-07-26 13:51 ` Robert Pluim
0 siblings, 0 replies; 12+ messages in thread
From: Robert Pluim @ 2024-07-26 13:51 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Sean Devlin; +Cc: Eli Zaretskii, 72294
>>>>> On Fri, 26 Jul 2024 09:48:11 -0400, Sean Devlin <spd@toadstyle.org> said:
>> An existing "init.el" file, if "~/.emacs" does not exist. Not a
>> ".emacs" file in the directory specified by
>> '--init-directory'. Because --init-directory changes
>> `user-emacs-directory’.
Sean> Correct, I only tested with a file named init.el, not .emacs.
Perhaps we should have a '--be-more-modern' flag that disables
searching for ".emacs" completely 😺 (I kid, I kid).
Robert
--
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* bug#72294: 29.2; Emacs --init-directory=... puts user-init-file elsewhere
2024-07-25 19:59 ` Sean Devlin
2024-07-26 6:15 ` Robert Pluim
@ 2024-07-26 6:16 ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-07-26 13:49 ` Sean Devlin
1 sibling, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Eli Zaretskii @ 2024-07-26 6:16 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Sean Devlin; +Cc: 72294-done
> From: Sean Devlin <spd@toadstyle.org>
> Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2024 15:59:45 -0400
> Cc: 72294@debbugs.gnu.org
>
> Hi,
>
> > I don't think this is a bug.
>
> Fair enough.
>
> > May I ask why you needed to use this option? It should not be
> > generally needed.
>
> Lately, I run Emacs from the emacs-30 branch with some local tweaks. I
> found a bug in Org, and I was trying to reproduce it in a stable version
> of Emacs with default configuration. The bug is in Org 9.7+, which is
> newer than what ships in Emacs 29.
>
> Since I knew I would need to install a package, I checked the manual for
> the command-line flags to specify the user-emacs-directory, and I found
> the --init-directory option. I opened an instance of Emacs 29.2 with
> --init-directory=/tmp/bug, and I installed Org via ELPA.
>
> Then, for an unrelated task, I opened an instance of my main Emacs
> installation, and I was surprised to see it load without any of my
> configuration. I discovered the Emacs 29 instance had written a file to
> ~/.emacs, shadowing my own configuration in ~/.emacs.d/init.el. That it
> wrote the user-init-file outside the user-emacs-directory I specified
> was surprising to me.
Thanks, I used this to improve the documentation of --init-directory
on the emacs-30 branch and make it more accurate, and I'm therefore
closing this bug.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2024-07-26 13:51 UTC | newest]
Thread overview: 12+ messages (download: mbox.gz follow: Atom feed
-- links below jump to the message on this page --
2024-07-25 16:12 bug#72294: 29.2; Emacs --init-directory=... puts user-init-file elsewhere Sean Devlin
2024-07-25 18:56 ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-07-25 19:59 ` Sean Devlin
2024-07-26 6:15 ` Robert Pluim
2024-07-26 10:34 ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-07-26 12:00 ` Robert Pluim
2024-07-26 12:03 ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-07-26 12:14 ` Robert Pluim
2024-07-26 13:48 ` Sean Devlin
2024-07-26 13:51 ` Robert Pluim
2024-07-26 6:16 ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-07-26 13:49 ` Sean Devlin
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