From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Marcin Borkowski Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#24197: Removing lisp/play from standard Emacs package Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2016 19:06:12 +0200 Message-ID: <87fuqcsge3.fsf@mbork.pl> References: NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1470848844 30219 195.159.176.226 (10 Aug 2016 17:07:24 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2016 17:07:24 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: mu4e 0.9.16; emacs 25.1.50.6 Cc: 24197@debbugs.gnu.org To: Otso Rajala Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Aug 10 19:07:20 2016 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bXWyN-0007fV-M7 for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Wed, 10 Aug 2016 19:07:19 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:42836 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bXWyK-0004zz-DQ for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Wed, 10 Aug 2016 13:07:16 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:36949) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bXWyA-0004zq-2a for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 10 Aug 2016 13:07:11 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bXWy5-0000G3-SQ for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 10 Aug 2016 13:07:04 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.43]:54831) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bXWy5-0000Fp-P2 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 10 Aug 2016 13:07:01 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bXWy5-0004s6-Kc for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 10 Aug 2016 13:07:01 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Marcin Borkowski Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2016 17:07:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 24197 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by 24197-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B24197.147084877318669 (code B ref 24197); Wed, 10 Aug 2016 17:07:01 +0000 Original-Received: (at 24197) by debbugs.gnu.org; 10 Aug 2016 17:06:13 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:52543 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bXWxJ-0004r2-7e for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 10 Aug 2016 13:06:13 -0400 Original-Received: from mail.mojserwer.eu ([195.110.48.8]:59090) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1bXWxH-0004qu-LH for 24197@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 10 Aug 2016 13:06:12 -0400 Original-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.mojserwer.eu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 12429E6031; Wed, 10 Aug 2016 19:06:09 +0200 (CEST) X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at mail.mojserwer.eu Original-Received: from mail.mojserwer.eu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.mojserwer.eu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 1BOkR20OjFLS; Wed, 10 Aug 2016 19:06:06 +0200 (CEST) Original-Received: from localhost (static-dwadziewiec-jedenpiec7.echostar.pl [109.232.29.157]) by mail.mojserwer.eu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 766CFE6029; Wed, 10 Aug 2016 19:06:06 +0200 (CEST) In-reply-to: X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 208.118.235.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "bug-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:122040 Archived-At: On 2016-08-10, at 15:43, Otso Rajala wrote: > Emacs is primarily used as a text editor. Toys shipped in lisp/play directory > are fun, no question about that. Do they belong into core disribution of Emacs > is another question. > > Problems: > 1) They increase package size. > 2) Their existence clutters M-x autocomplete lists: example M-x bu > has all things buffer, but also shows bubbles and butterfly, hardly useful > during editing process. How am I supposed to do any serious coding without M-x butterfly??? > 3) Tools > Games is a bit confusing: games are not tools by definition. Games are tools for solving problems with the developer's mood. > 4) Help > Psychotherapist is toy in documentation menu. That is clearly a mistake - psychotherapy is Serious Business. > Advantage of solution: > 1) All problems go away This can also be accomplished with M-x doctor. No need to tamper with Emacs distro. > 2) Simple lisp game sources now easily accessible right from common browser > for fun & inspiration without having to download 56M tar.gz editor with them. But in order to have a browser (eww), I have to download the editor anyway. > 3) Fair towards other toys, considering sokoban and wpuzzle are there but don't > ship by default. Ah, I've got you here! How much did the authors of sokoban and wpuzzle pay you? ;-) > - Otso SNCR, -- Marcin Borkowski http://octd.wmi.amu.edu.pl/en/Marcin_Borkowski Faculty of Mathematics and Computer Science Adam Mickiewicz University