From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Lars Ingebrigtsen Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#1305: All code that currently beeps should use visual bell instead Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2021 14:55:03 +0200 Message-ID: <87a6pxqdeg.fsf@gnus.org> References: <009901c9421f$5bd0a6b0$0200a8c0@us.oracle.com> <00ad01c942a0$1f49ca60$0200a8c0@us.oracle.com> <87eef9qg81.fsf@gnus.org> <1869622e162377be79e9@heytings.org> <83bladw0dh.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="4135"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) Cc: Gregory Heytings , 1305@debbugs.gnu.org, stefan@marxist.se, jasonspiro4@gmail.com, monnier@iro.umontreal.ca To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat Apr 17 14:56:10 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1lXkUb-0000wx-5m for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 17 Apr 2021 14:56:09 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:35220 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lXkUa-00085p-5m for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 17 Apr 2021 08:56:08 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:52122) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lXkUU-00085j-4T for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 17 Apr 2021 08:56:02 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.43]:59146) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lXkUT-0006It-SA for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 17 Apr 2021 08:56:01 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lXkUT-0007Rj-P3 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 17 Apr 2021 08:56:01 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Lars Ingebrigtsen Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2021 12:56:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 1305 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs Original-Received: via spool by 1305-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B1305.161866412328575 (code B ref 1305); Sat, 17 Apr 2021 12:56:01 +0000 Original-Received: (at 1305) by debbugs.gnu.org; 17 Apr 2021 12:55:23 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:42459 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lXkTq-0007Qp-V0 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 17 Apr 2021 08:55:23 -0400 Original-Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:49368) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lXkTp-0007QZ-81 for 1305@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 17 Apr 2021 08:55:21 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=FUXq7jl2kj9PZ39H7jR0uPSJeLaWq8aLiX7fKfyionw=; b=EykselXvli1trzxsFLsQiOOmOw 2zFW/tzJwicUd4ZiXfSktnAfrqR8BDLeviaIkV/Vefd/e8GyMzGbPFP/cw2rVW8ZklFbSYlAaPbBf 15Rt9ep9YAvoRx9XAAkiKJiL4HpIC3UF27nHexeq52m7PxYLQK2OaJ2GYuDQ4WgbGpYs=; Original-Received: from cm-84.212.220.105.getinternet.no ([84.212.220.105] helo=xo) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1lXkTY-0003Iz-GB; Sat, 17 Apr 2021 14:55:06 +0200 Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwBAMAAAClLOS0AAAABGdBTUEAALGPC/xhBQAAACBj SFJNAAB6JgAAgIQAAPoAAACA6AAAdTAAAOpgAAA6mAAAF3CculE8AAAAG1BMVEWtp5nl3ci0rqPN vq+alYyRf2dbUFETCgz///+G0CkAAAAAAWJLR0QIht6VegAAAAd0SU1FB+UEEQwxNQ6MjF4AAAFc SURBVDjLldTdboMgFAdwykx67Zrd02Oz3baebrvtBcYH8OveVniBTl5/gCJKNNn+iTHyywH5ULKL 10OOf4YDmmg4UDBhxIXrlDHZHQhdtFu5GaABRBMEBXNgQU+cu8FDuG3BVAFBOx/HqGyKdJhQ5KEW NuOtm+DUC9mrnpeNMvmZgAkhhWzxU9/7WgQgksR2FVQIecezaZchiBQxZTyTqnssoAW7D9h0VbcA SEwzwVrUzzk8UgN71eZSPE8DgAVIri+oVL/X16ICk7xI9ezyEAjmxaVR/UcIlQbU0Dg4zkHatfIA erYa7huwv1/FHGILPYf34kstACyAnvr3GhANb1uQrgLVi9WsjsEysVZhtk6NrxtNkFUuJedZ6QER fNyBi8dHG+YOqQcrw/E2cPEAlFlgQVdAGB0/0iioAPeVLrtihLoSV5EMJw3PzFdkBtzf5BX8+0UG Nv4l/4ZfnCnXdaRaFEoAAAAldEVYdGRhdGU6Y3JlYXRlADIwMjEtMDQtMTdUMTI6NDk6NTIrMDA6 MDDmYy/eAAAAJXRFWHRkYXRlOm1vZGlmeQAyMDIxLTA0LTE3VDEyOjQ5OjUyKzAwOjAwlz6XYgAA AABJRU5ErkJggg== X-Now-Playing: Blaine L. Reininger's _Live in Brussels_: "track" In-Reply-To: <83bladw0dh.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sat, 17 Apr 2021 15:39:54 +0300") X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "bug-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:204198 Archived-At: Eli Zaretskii writes: >> IMO, the default behavior on GNU/Linux (inverting video on the first and >> last line of the frame) is horrible (but perhaps less so than an actual >> bell), Hm... when I try this on Debian/bullseye, it inverts the video on the two first lines in the frame. But I seem to recall it working the way you describe, so perhaps there's differences between various toolkits/libraries used by Emacs in this area? >> and the default behavior on macOS is too intrusive (but again >> perhaps less so than an actual bell). > > On MS-Windows, we use a system API that flashes the caption bar of the > selected-frame's window. Then it sounds like visible-bell should be visible enough on all the three major systems we support. However, I just noticed that an "emacs -Q" doesn't beep at all on this machine -- because I've switched off all "alert" beeps in the OS interface. So `C-g' just says "Quit" in the echo area, and nothing else. So in this instance, defaulting `visible-bell' to "on" would make `C-g' more intrusive/obnoxious than previously... which is the opposite effect than what was originally discussed in this bug report. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no