From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Jonathan Reeve Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#57531: 28.1; Character encoding missing for "eo" Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2022 20:00:41 +0000 Message-ID: <875yi4p6se.fsf@jonreeve.com> References: <87h71r0w5z.fsf@jonreeve.com> <83h71qqq5e.fsf@gnu.org> <878rn1p7oz.fsf@jonreeve.com> <8335d8o6ow.fsf@gnu.org> <877d2kpfe1.fsf@jonreeve.com> <83o7vwmlet.fsf@gnu.org> Reply-To: Jonathan Reeve Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="23671"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: 57531@debbugs.gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat Sep 03 22:01:29 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1oUZKb-00061S-3g for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 03 Sep 2022 22:01:29 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:46910 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oUZKa-00007v-6K for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 03 Sep 2022 16:01:28 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:50562) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oUZKA-00006o-RS for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 03 Sep 2022 16:01:03 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.43]:54411) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oUZKA-00024B-D5 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 03 Sep 2022 16:01:02 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oUZKA-0000y1-5N for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 03 Sep 2022 16:01:02 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Jonathan Reeve Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2022 20:01:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 57531 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: moreinfo Original-Received: via spool by 57531-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B57531.16622352533695 (code B ref 57531); Sat, 03 Sep 2022 20:01:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 57531) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 Sep 2022 20:00:53 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:43110 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oUZK1-0000xW-8n for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Sep 2022 16:00:53 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-4317.proton.ch ([185.70.43.17]:48443) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oUZJz-0000xH-I4 for 57531@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Sep 2022 16:00:52 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=jonreeve.com; s=protonmail3; t=1662235244; x=1662494444; bh=+qZk5hzpUKPdJnehzWoyNSb8yc9WFVDV+lYbvG06HTc=; h=Date:To:From:Cc:Reply-To:Subject:Message-ID:In-Reply-To: References:Feedback-ID:From:To:Cc:Date:Subject:Reply-To: Feedback-ID:Message-ID; b=dhTNQqk2nqE3Wk7fh2FqgCmOQ3brwpLdHojfm8v60d8Am5MFX+PhTVcXgzNHVthUy bRG6Er3dQMW52Ob/PA+q8QWBwotLGk2WdB2t+Ln10Z39bJWKBKsAUf2Eo+H50XMKlv ltzj8B+5gGzam4N5OECjxj0LLzydiQxWyxyMD8lLDk1JtZS0ZF4g4mGRNgXcw6Nl3p 6mgFJpHmUiGKFqLUe4u5cPHM3D+sAt49cu/W2tWmpgfmUmPeRGcMFTZk3c6D+muwOm q2LIFNHumUx1eCLQHaTiiMuBjO1A9q6enPKVQ8pd/jVAexOOnmjJ0WSw5Ka2TzCMiq 0LMHyM3taBANQ== In-Reply-To: <83o7vwmlet.fsf@gnu.org> Feedback-ID: 35010347:user:proton X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "bug-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:241450 Archived-At: > I believe this is due to the fact that the text was saved in UTF-8, > and Emacs was trying to decode it as if it were in Latin-3. That=E2=80=99s the problem. Emacs should decode UTF-8 as UTF-8, not Latin-3= . The fact that it assumes a UTF-8 locale is in fact a Latin-3 locale, with= out any reasoning for that, is a problem. > Using the prefer-coding-system customization should fix that. The user shouldn=E2=80=99t have to customize an encoding system to have a U= TF-8 locale be interpreted as UTF-8. A UTF-8 locale should be encoded as su= ch, without needing to be told otherwise. > I disagree. I think your system doesn=E2=80=99t tell Emacs enough to gue= ss > correctly. It does, though. The locale data is already there, which is why I only have= this problem in Emacs, and nowhere else on my whole system. The problem is= in this line from `locale-language-names'. Here=E2=80=99s what it says: `("eo" . "Esperanto")' Here=E2=80=99s what it should say: `("eo" "Esperanto" utf-8)' > There=E2=80=99s no evidence of =E2=80=9Ceo=E2=80=9D being a UTF-8 locale,= except what we see > in glibc. Which is just one library on just one OS. The evidence is everywhere, in fact, across my whole system, and every othe= r system I=E2=80=99ve used. And glibc is not just one library on one OS: it= =E2=80=99s the reference data for locales across any UNIX-like or POSIX sys= tem. Show me any other library on any other OS that has locale data that suggest= s that =E2=80=9Ceo=E2=80=9D is anything other than UTF-8. In particular, sh= ow me a library that shows that the eo locale should be encoded as latin-3. > Emacs cannot know the system character set unless the system tells > that. The way to tell that is via the locale=E2=80=99s codeset. If that= is > impossible, the next best is for you to tell that to Emacs in your > init file. I don=E2=80=99t understand why you insist on not using the > solution I proposed. The system says that it=E2=80=99s a UTF-8 locale. It=E2=80=99s interpreted = as a UTF-8 locale by every other program except for emacs. It=E2=80=99s onl= y emacs that incorrectly assumes latin-3, and for no reason, as far as I ca= n tell. That=E2=80=99s because it=E2=80=99s getting its locale/encoding inf= ormation from `locale-language-names', which is incorrect, or at least inco= mplete. > Please try the solution I proposed, and if it doesn=E2=80=99t work, let= =E2=80=99s see > what else is needed. If you keep insisting on defaulting Esperanto to > UTF-8, I see now way to make any progress here. You=E2=80=99re not proposing a solution, you=E2=80=99re proposing a workaro= und. Any other user with the =E2=80=9Ceo=E2=80=9D locale will have this sam= e problem, and they shouldn=E2=80=99t be expected to find this email thread= , in order to find a special hack to have their system work as expected. There=E2=80=99s no reason at all why Esperanto should be encoded in latin-3= . It never has been, as far as I can tell, and it never well be, in latin-3= , with the eo locale. If you can find any good reason why it should be in l= atin-3, I=E2=80=99m all ears, but as far as I can tell, this is a mistake. Please keep in mind that /I=E2=80=99m trying to help improve emacs,/ by sub= mitting a bug report about behavior in emacs that is incorrect and potentia= lly causing problems for many users. Language like =E2=80=9CI see now way t= o make any progress here=E2=80=9D doesn=E2=80=99t extend any courtesy, any = effort towards understanding this problem, or even any effort towards givin= g it the benefit of the doubt. It makes the bug reporting process unnecessa= rily adversarial, and, quite frankly, feels unprofessional.