From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Lars Ingebrigtsen Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#30978: 25.3; Suggestion: define-minor-mode should define mode-lighter variable Date: Thu, 29 Jul 2021 14:11:07 +0200 Message-ID: <874kcds4kk.fsf@gnus.org> References: <874l3ou42z.fsf@mouse.gnus.org> <87sgcdft5w.fsf@gnus.org> <87pmwadno8.fsf@gnus.org> <97892e0eebeeff0413287058d68ad86b@webmail.orcon.net.nz> <87r1fmx1qx.fsf@gnus.org> <87o8ambgkw.fsf@gnus.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="2951"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) Cc: 30978@debbugs.gnu.org To: Howard Melman Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Thu Jul 29 14:12:11 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1m94tX-0000Ys-Bm for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 29 Jul 2021 14:12:11 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:35274 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1m94tW-0000Aq-7s for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 29 Jul 2021 08:12:10 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:58472) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1m94tO-00009s-2p for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 29 Jul 2021 08:12:02 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.43]:45293) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1m94tN-0007wM-PP for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 29 Jul 2021 08:12:01 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1m94tN-00047K-Hc for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 29 Jul 2021 08:12:01 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Lars Ingebrigtsen Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Thu, 29 Jul 2021 12:12:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 30978 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: moreinfo wontfix Original-Received: via spool by 30978-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B30978.162756068015773 (code B ref 30978); Thu, 29 Jul 2021 12:12:01 +0000 Original-Received: (at 30978) by debbugs.gnu.org; 29 Jul 2021 12:11:20 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56839 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1m94sh-00046K-Oc for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 29 Jul 2021 08:11:20 -0400 Original-Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:58734) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1m94sf-000466-J7 for 30978@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 29 Jul 2021 08:11:18 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID :In-Reply-To:Date:References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-ID: Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc :Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe:List-Subscribe: List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=jMNjGKeTAS8MzFOpRFeGQrjt122Km4Y2fnbgAdkik6c=; b=Z0iXpScF1EXGKWZ9hi/s56+UtC TewrvXZ+B8NB+i/nNOtU8ovpdp1c6dbPzgF7MdrH35FZfgEj+lpScfRcjmNFl4NZ90/zwNpcdyBUK sZ+NtBS4Z/LutNeK1MQ4rrjHiy0Sd+g2VYxKDkldf81tKwzcuQ9viFhDpNfWqw4PoPj8=; Original-Received: from 2.149.45.105.tmi.telenormobil.no ([2.149.45.105] helo=elva) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1m94sW-0002gs-Jt; Thu, 29 Jul 2021 14:11:11 +0200 In-Reply-To: (Howard Melman's message of "Wed, 28 Jul 2021 15:10:00 -0400") X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "bug-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:210855 Archived-At: Howard Melman writes: > Maybe include an example of disabling a lighter in the elisp > manual (where minor-mode-alist is mentioned). E.g., > > (setcar (cdr (assoc 'eldoc-mode minor-mode-alist)) "") > > I realize this is "pretty easy" lisp but it's not a simple > setq and I think non-lispers might want to do this. K=C3=A9vin Le Gouguec writes: > Manipulating minor-mode-alist is not that hard indeed; there are some > sources of hassle though: > > (1) figuring out the name of the mode variable (e.g. auto-fill-function, > defining-kbd-macro); > > (2) some modes seem not to add their variables to minor-mode-alist for > some reason (e.g. caps-lock-mode on GNU ELPA), so this recipe does > not work (neither does delight); one needs to fallback to > add-to-list. > > Nothing too herculean, but I'm sure some users would appreciate a > built-in function to figure out this stuff for them. I did consider adding a new function like `set-minor-mode-lighter' that would just alter `minor-mode-alist' like that setcar, but that has (at least) two problems -- the one you mention in (1), and loading precedence issues: If you alter the entry in `minor-mode-alist', and then load the .el file with the `define-minor-mode', then it'll overwrite your own setting. So you have to say (require 'foo) (setcar ...) in your .emacs to make it work reliably, so just adding a naive helper function, or talking about this too much, is that helpful, because it'll trip people up. Adding a -lighter defcustom would indeed have none of these problems, but I'm just not sure that people would use it enough to justify the (minor) performance impact, as well as the defcustom explosion. Which is why I think that using a package like delight is the right solution here for those that want to change the lighters. Probably. --=20 (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no