From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: dick.r.chiang@gmail.com Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#48949: 28.0.50; Thread-Process Liberalization Date: Fri, 11 Jun 2021 06:26:28 -0400 Message-ID: <871r98d7e3.fsf@dick> References: <877dj1pict.fsf@dick> <8335tpaqvw.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="8766"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.14 (Gnus v5.14pre) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) Cc: 48949@debbugs.gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii , Lars Ingebrigtsen Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Fri Jun 11 12:27:11 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1lreNb-00023B-FN for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 11 Jun 2021 12:27:11 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:53858 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lreNZ-0001iU-MR for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 11 Jun 2021 06:27:09 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:58994) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lreNS-0001iM-FY for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 11 Jun 2021 06:27:02 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.43]:54890) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lreNS-0002jn-7k for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 11 Jun 2021 06:27:02 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lreNS-0005qd-1I for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 11 Jun 2021 06:27:02 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: dick.r.chiang@gmail.com Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Fri, 11 Jun 2021 10:27:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 48949 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs Original-Received: via spool by 48949-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B48949.162340719822450 (code B ref 48949); Fri, 11 Jun 2021 10:27:01 +0000 Original-Received: (at 48949) by debbugs.gnu.org; 11 Jun 2021 10:26:38 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:38203 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lreN3-0005q1-Kz for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 11 Jun 2021 06:26:37 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-qk1-f175.google.com ([209.85.222.175]:38451) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lreN1-0005po-DZ for 48949@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 11 Jun 2021 06:26:35 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-qk1-f175.google.com with SMTP id c138so17518261qkg.5 for <48949@debbugs.gnu.org>; Fri, 11 Jun 2021 03:26:35 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id :user-agent:mime-version; bh=V6pEarNKQw+vJTkP7yS8UJqRPgaQa2Pjjqvn1Ysqjbo=; b=bM33kGlpIKK6cmEV6prur0MjKSDpVWoOl9IEaqUDBgDKo4DlmSMYRjApEM3UZwat2I QHRu21L+sJqOGp42R48wi9QIR92ZEnXbqMSl+JNdgFVaBwfz8olHZrk8c4fgtL4bc/CQ jnsqVgXtRJYSO8kdhoTM4Ps1fynxpIMdvmTaE5MNQgoE3dgptzZ/8nYfUO44c+VLLIv4 viSSRzWgpRi56908hwfsO6P0aQwxF0aJj3fvnnyn2em/IjcXN6PXNaXNxSVEMjN2k/C8 N05nTJixxwtzny1cI2T/iRd2MqJVeKt8iCOIYcslefP6mLkdCcOyBxrMNfFr/inP6UyT me8A== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to :message-id:user-agent:mime-version; bh=V6pEarNKQw+vJTkP7yS8UJqRPgaQa2Pjjqvn1Ysqjbo=; b=EWFTwZl7Fbd1ZcN1BHUvepuAKIql8h1AtLIANYAuksKjx7CThQqZPNEo+hhW9bx35g y7PsR312Sku1a1A6g3C3oI6ssSvf35G1gIh6oP08LZ794m0nTsCymK4tLvj6mkLW5Sxr vnui9hzT2ChvVRNU22cBXY+XfyDxSOzVZiQCa2OvgVr7NSfxjsmqDfex1Km5WGOcGNU9 SnOgIfbHvoxQuBK7JZQ9MXqUTec4l23FXMSechz3KO4ZR+mWAZcsox4HNu8ZbuCBzefD yNmpsoBxn2LoplBrH1bf7PBg7PPhBKKUu7jqcEe7z0nFzpiLR78s3FbmyzK9DfvsAIiA ZEFQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530Bi3EoURc6MRYOdGhAuDFFnheQmDXiGD1Msi2fSDHtnsFaSm1K L04bidg0cXzz1E7Yl4HyGw0= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzortWdC+/BaAVH0l15mIgQ7W3S0sHLfJj4TFY42YPSIkecxXFSrgeVmG2by+aTFTY8xkWHTg== X-Received: by 2002:a05:620a:e02:: with SMTP id y2mr3088631qkm.54.1623407189769; Fri, 11 Jun 2021 03:26:29 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from localhost (pool-71-190-212-171.nycmny.fios.verizon.net. [71.190.212.171]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id m68sm4102457qkb.75.2021.06.11.03.26.29 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-CHACHA20-POLY1305 bits=256/256); Fri, 11 Jun 2021 03:26:29 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <8335tpaqvw.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Fri, 11 Jun 2021 08:53:39 +0300") X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "bug-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:208343 Archived-At: Well, this response and that of #bug36609 effectively puts the kibosh on my dream of Gnus 2.0 (a working version at github.com/dickmao/gnus I run rather delightedly every day). It's a more-than-5000 line change thus far, so given the vigorous pushback on what I considered to be non-controversial changes in #bug48949 and #bug36609, it never really had a chance. Gnus is such an awesome idea, but it is so, so poorly written and obtuse. In fairness to its original authors, I could not have written it better if I were 20yo and worked on it alongside a full-time job. Heck at that age I could barely piece together a sentence, much less write a kitchen-sink messaging system in an impoverished, early implementation of elisp. My narcissism is such that I feel I'm the only person on the planet with the time and skill to "Make Gnus Great (MGG)", not "Great Again" since it was never that.