From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#70784: Abolish string resizing Date: Tue, 07 May 2024 14:13:30 +0300 Message-ID: <868r0lc1t1.fsf@gnu.org> References: <86v83rb2bl.fsf@gnu.org> <87ttjb3yzy.fsf@yahoo.com> Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="10951"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: mattias.engdegard@gmail.com, 70784@debbugs.gnu.org, monnier@iro.umontreal.ca, drew.adams@oracle.com To: Po Lu Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Tue May 07 13:14:57 2024 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1s4Ime-0002ew-HM for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Tue, 07 May 2024 13:14:56 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1s4ImQ-0002F9-EF; Tue, 07 May 2024 07:14:42 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1s4ImL-0002Eg-Mw for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 07 May 2024 07:14:37 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:5::43]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1s4ImL-0003UO-D2 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 07 May 2024 07:14:37 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1s4Imk-0000LS-48 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 07 May 2024 07:15:02 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Eli Zaretskii Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Tue, 07 May 2024 11:15:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 70784 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs Original-Received: via spool by 70784-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B70784.17150804501294 (code B ref 70784); Tue, 07 May 2024 11:15:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 70784) by debbugs.gnu.org; 7 May 2024 11:14:10 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:42529 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1s4Ilu-0000Km-0X for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 07 May 2024 07:14:10 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:45004) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1s4Ilq-0000KV-Sr for 70784@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 07 May 2024 07:14:08 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1s4IlL-0003Pz-IG; Tue, 07 May 2024 07:13:35 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=ZCaNqRiQ16uXETXRey4RuPdnYXCw8SxfUl1gNgxsLY8=; b=JILHUOFINQCe 3FIo1yFUv44oxVScOl8haubSkyTVRlEFnLFMuG5L2DRT26D3nQNHzeVSHUxZlbVLFzleJZrE8doWh l8eNJWJnevd39HwWnH1y2kK9LPx/1swghH1lAE1ZvYsE6pggTAPcKi0IawO+UIuqK0eEhzMdhBKk4 xoQDnBP4S6wC/hUPCzVPXbd0g3Q0AZ19ijq1s8iBiMAhvrmONWwCsv3WXhXBmvd/hGg/S1dGvN0XU J59noO8iocbyMtWp5zuoqbyR117exWapMGhL5Sm4+2KTm05cqmkf2mh373yJc2ubt+NSRt7s/eu7A e5Qgsm9hBNzcVB9VRAB9BA==; In-Reply-To: <87ttjb3yzy.fsf@yahoo.com> (message from Po Lu on Mon, 06 May 2024 20:29:05 +0800) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:284635 Archived-At: > From: Po Lu > Cc: Drew Adams , mattias.engdegard@gmail.com, > 70784@debbugs.gnu.org, monnier@iro.umontreal.ca > Date: Mon, 06 May 2024 20:29:05 +0800 > > Eli Zaretskii writes: > > > Which is why no one is proposing to make string immutable. This is > > not what this proposal is about, and Mattias made a point of saying > > that explicitly. > > The point is that CL string implementations are capable of modifying > strings in such a manner as Mattias proposes to "abolish". I presume > some are implemented as Emacs's are, while others simply use a > representation for multibyte strings where all characters are the same > wide size (which incidentally there's nothing preventing Emacs from > implementing). That doesn't really matter. "Other applications" do things that Emacs doesn't necessarily want to do, or vice versa. E.g., consider our support for raw bytes in multibyte strings, which is quite unique. What _would_ matter is if there are important use cases out there where replacing one character by another character of a different multibyte length. So if you, or anyone else, can come up with such situations (which are not made up specifically to argue here), please do, because knowing about such situations would be useful to make this discussion serious and based on facts.