* bug#24369: Docu of prefix-numeric-value @ 2016-09-05 7:52 Andreas Röhler 2016-09-05 15:57 ` Drew Adams 0 siblings, 1 reply; 9+ messages in thread From: Andreas Röhler @ 2016-09-05 7:52 UTC (permalink / raw) To: 24369 See recent question at http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/help-gnu-emacs/2016-09/msg00018.html Please add some explanation WRT treatment of the nil-argument. Also WRT C-u Thanks! ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 9+ messages in thread
* bug#24369: Docu of prefix-numeric-value 2016-09-05 7:52 bug#24369: Docu of prefix-numeric-value Andreas Röhler @ 2016-09-05 15:57 ` Drew Adams 2016-09-05 17:44 ` Andreas Röhler 0 siblings, 1 reply; 9+ messages in thread From: Drew Adams @ 2016-09-05 15:57 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Andreas Röhler, 24369 > See recent question at > http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/help-gnu-emacs/2016-09/msg00018.html > > Please add some explanation WRT treatment of the nil-argument. > Also WRT C-u What "treatment" are you asking to be explained? Just what do you think is missing? ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 9+ messages in thread
* bug#24369: Docu of prefix-numeric-value 2016-09-05 15:57 ` Drew Adams @ 2016-09-05 17:44 ` Andreas Röhler 2016-09-05 17:46 ` Drew Adams 2016-09-05 17:57 ` Eli Zaretskii 0 siblings, 2 replies; 9+ messages in thread From: Andreas Röhler @ 2016-09-05 17:44 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Drew Adams, 24369 On 05.09.2016 17:57, Drew Adams wrote: >> See recent question at >> http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/help-gnu-emacs/2016-09/msg00018.html >> >> Please add some explanation WRT treatment of the nil-argument. >> Also WRT C-u > What "treatment" are you asking to be explained? > Just what do you think is missing? Elisp Info 20.2.2 Code Characters for ‘interactive’ ---------------------------------------- p’ The numeric prefix argument User will expect the argument received by function being consistent with input, i.e. M-x 2 foo... sends 2, M-x 1 foo ... sends 1. From there omitting an argument will be expected to send nothing - which isn't the case. Likewise with uppecase P. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 9+ messages in thread
* bug#24369: Docu of prefix-numeric-value 2016-09-05 17:44 ` Andreas Röhler @ 2016-09-05 17:46 ` Drew Adams 2016-09-05 17:57 ` Eli Zaretskii 1 sibling, 0 replies; 9+ messages in thread From: Drew Adams @ 2016-09-05 17:46 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Andreas Röhler, 24369 > > What "treatment" are you asking to be explained? > > Just what do you think is missing? > > Elisp Info 20.2.2 Code Characters for ‘interactive’ > ---------------------------------------- > > p The numeric prefix argument > > Likewise with uppecase P. Again, what do you think is missing? `p' is the numeric prefix argument. `P' is the raw prefix argument. This is not the Elisp manual node that describes WHAT these things are. But there is a link here to the node that does that, node `Prefix Command Arguments' http://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_node/elisp/Prefix-Command-Arguments.html And that's the case even in the Emacs 20 version of the manual, which you cited. > User will expect the argument received by function being consistent with > input, i.e. M-x 2 foo... sends 2, M-x 1 foo ... sends 1. From there > omitting an argument will be expected to send nothing - which isn't the > case. Why on Earth would the user expect that, simply from reading that `interactive' code `p' returns the numeric prefix argument and `P' returns the raw prefix argument? ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 9+ messages in thread
* bug#24369: Docu of prefix-numeric-value 2016-09-05 17:44 ` Andreas Röhler 2016-09-05 17:46 ` Drew Adams @ 2016-09-05 17:57 ` Eli Zaretskii 2016-09-05 18:33 ` Andreas Röhler 1 sibling, 1 reply; 9+ messages in thread From: Eli Zaretskii @ 2016-09-05 17:57 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Andreas Röhler; +Cc: 24369 > From: Andreas Röhler <andreas.roehler@easy-emacs.de> > Date: Mon, 5 Sep 2016 19:44:28 +0200 > > >> Please add some explanation WRT treatment of the nil-argument. > >> Also WRT C-u > > What "treatment" are you asking to be explained? > > Just what do you think is missing? > > Elisp Info 20.2.2 Code Characters for ‘interactive’ > ---------------------------------------- > > p’ > The numeric prefix argument > > User will expect the argument received by function being consistent with > input, i.e. M-x 2 foo... sends 2, M-x 1 foo ... sends 1. From there > omitting an argument will be expected to send nothing - which isn't the > case. There's more in the manual than just that one paragraph. ELisp manual 20.12 Prefix Command Arguments: ------------------------------------------- There are two representations of the prefix argument: “raw” and “numeric”. The editor command loop uses the raw representation internally, and so do the Lisp variables that store the information, but commands can request either representation. Here are the possible values of a raw prefix argument: • ‘nil’, meaning there is no prefix argument. Its numeric value is 1, but numerous commands make a distinction between ‘nil’ and the integer 1. ... -- Function: prefix-numeric-value arg This function returns the numeric meaning of a valid raw prefix argument value, ARG. The argument may be a symbol, a number, or a list. If it is ‘nil’, the value 1 is returned; if it is ‘-’, the value −1 is returned; if it is a number, that number is returned; if it is a list, the CAR of that list (which should be a number) is returned. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 9+ messages in thread
* bug#24369: Docu of prefix-numeric-value 2016-09-05 17:57 ` Eli Zaretskii @ 2016-09-05 18:33 ` Andreas Röhler 2016-09-05 18:57 ` Eli Zaretskii 0 siblings, 1 reply; 9+ messages in thread From: Andreas Röhler @ 2016-09-05 18:33 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Eli Zaretskii; +Cc: 24369 On 05.09.2016 19:57, Eli Zaretskii wrote: > > Here are the possible values of a raw prefix argument: > > • ‘nil’, meaning there is no prefix argument. Its numeric value is > 1, That's the point: Value of nil is 1 Value of 1 is 1 But he value of 2 is 2 Consistency means something different. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 9+ messages in thread
* bug#24369: Docu of prefix-numeric-value 2016-09-05 18:33 ` Andreas Röhler @ 2016-09-05 18:57 ` Eli Zaretskii 2016-09-05 21:03 ` Drew Adams 0 siblings, 1 reply; 9+ messages in thread From: Eli Zaretskii @ 2016-09-05 18:57 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Andreas Röhler; +Cc: 24369 > Cc: drew.adams@oracle.com, 24369@debbugs.gnu.org > From: Andreas Röhler <andreas.roehler@easy-emacs.de> > Date: Mon, 5 Sep 2016 20:33:21 +0200 > > > • ‘nil’, meaning there is no prefix argument. Its numeric value is > > 1, > > That's the point: > > Value of nil is 1 No, the _numeric_ value of nil is 1. IOW, nil, when interpreted as a number, is 1. An entirely different story. > Consistency means something different. The numeric value of nil is consistently 1. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 9+ messages in thread
* bug#24369: Docu of prefix-numeric-value 2016-09-05 18:57 ` Eli Zaretskii @ 2016-09-05 21:03 ` Drew Adams 2017-07-17 1:37 ` npostavs 0 siblings, 1 reply; 9+ messages in thread From: Drew Adams @ 2016-09-05 21:03 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Eli Zaretskii, Andreas Röhler; +Cc: 24369 > > > • ‘nil’, meaning there is no prefix argument. Its numeric value > > > is 1, > > > > That's the point: Value of nil is 1 > > No, the _numeric_ value of nil is 1. IOW, nil, when interpreted > as a number, is 1. An entirely different story. Exactly. The value of `(prefix-numeric-value nil)' is 1. That's what "numeric value of" the prefix argument means. It is also what the shorter expression "the numeric prefix argument" means. The fact that the value of some function applied to nil is 1 does not mean that the value of nil is 1. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 9+ messages in thread
* bug#24369: Docu of prefix-numeric-value 2016-09-05 21:03 ` Drew Adams @ 2017-07-17 1:37 ` npostavs 0 siblings, 0 replies; 9+ messages in thread From: npostavs @ 2017-07-17 1:37 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Drew Adams; +Cc: 24369 tags 24369 notabug close 24369 quit Drew Adams <drew.adams@oracle.com> writes: >> > > • ‘nil’, meaning there is no prefix argument. Its numeric value >> > > is 1, >> > >> > That's the point: Value of nil is 1 >> >> No, the _numeric_ value of nil is 1. IOW, nil, when interpreted >> as a number, is 1. An entirely different story. > > Exactly. The value of `(prefix-numeric-value nil)' is 1. > > That's what "numeric value of" the prefix argument means. > It is also what the shorter expression "the numeric prefix > argument" means. > > The fact that the value of some function applied to nil > is 1 does not mean that the value of nil is 1. I think there is nothing more to be done here, so I'm closing the bug. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 9+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2017-07-17 1:37 UTC | newest] Thread overview: 9+ messages (download: mbox.gz follow: Atom feed -- links below jump to the message on this page -- 2016-09-05 7:52 bug#24369: Docu of prefix-numeric-value Andreas Röhler 2016-09-05 15:57 ` Drew Adams 2016-09-05 17:44 ` Andreas Röhler 2016-09-05 17:46 ` Drew Adams 2016-09-05 17:57 ` Eli Zaretskii 2016-09-05 18:33 ` Andreas Röhler 2016-09-05 18:57 ` Eli Zaretskii 2016-09-05 21:03 ` Drew Adams 2017-07-17 1:37 ` npostavs
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