From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#60646: 28.2; delete-selection-mode Date: Sat, 14 Jan 2023 14:34:19 +0200 Message-ID: <83sfgd70s4.fsf@gnu.org> References: <878ri5dihq.fsf@yahoo.com> <87sfgd8hb6.fsf@gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="8955"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: luangruo@yahoo.com, err291@mail.usask.ca, 60646@debbugs.gnu.org, drew.adams@oracle.com To: =?UTF-8?Q?K=C3=A9vin?= Le Gouguec Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat Jan 14 13:35:25 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1pGfkq-000244-Vi for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 14 Jan 2023 13:35:25 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pGfkX-0001u6-IN; Sat, 14 Jan 2023 07:35:05 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pGfkU-0001tm-P4 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 14 Jan 2023 07:35:02 -0500 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.43]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pGfkU-0002Ni-GL for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 14 Jan 2023 07:35:02 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1pGfkU-0004VO-2Y for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 14 Jan 2023 07:35:02 -0500 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Eli Zaretskii Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Jan 2023 12:35:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 60646 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs Original-Received: via spool by 60646-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B60646.167369966917275 (code B ref 60646); Sat, 14 Jan 2023 12:35:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 60646) by debbugs.gnu.org; 14 Jan 2023 12:34:29 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:53599 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1pGfjx-0004UZ-52 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 14 Jan 2023 07:34:29 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:48238) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1pGfjs-0004UJ-MH for 60646@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 14 Jan 2023 07:34:27 -0500 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pGfjm-0002J8-SH; Sat, 14 Jan 2023 07:34:18 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=Morkw7/jU+AjHVsTd+1aXS9dXpISn8Lxo4prZjNXeec=; b=oYs3fcPXRUzag7BU72nZ qaZvAJ4H0Fq/h/ApcGfY4c5vKeLSx4gHIvRkkczr2mQXDmMxn5rfeMunETx3Ozy1tsxeRqaoJhc0R cZ4ljGE9KssXa9S/nljNcNKENN7a8dmUzTVwCKwBw0DG1cnztJcKLDkwZSSt/JnYyWirGwhm5Aayf vKeuCbOsnrDri/EDIvsuCPp9OVO+jV3UTdqpWMArzpiOlgXaRNvlUdcA4fisnYguLv5fqYH84MlgX Dc99p7WpNUQIcQGbJ2nlKOGaq6BsIHHOZA/hKUEpgDB/ABC9SZtFblotWyjaQIPbEjjzAjaYVFCFg y6hY+QjJ3RndWA==; Original-Received: from [87.69.77.57] (helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pGfjm-0001yQ-Ba; Sat, 14 Jan 2023 07:34:18 -0500 In-Reply-To: <87sfgd8hb6.fsf@gmail.com> (message from =?UTF-8?Q?K=C3=A9vin?= Le Gouguec on Sat, 14 Jan 2023 12:51:57 +0100) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:253353 Archived-At: > Cc: luangruo@yahoo.com, err291@mail.usask.ca, drew.adams@oracle.com > From: Kévin Le Gouguec > Date: Sat, 14 Jan 2023 12:51:57 +0100 > > >> +1. I've advocated the same for decades. > >> > >> This should have happened when we turned on > >> `transient-mark-mode' by default. And both > >> of those default-behavior changes should > >> really have happened long before that. > > > > I disagree, but we've had this argument before, so please just leave > > things as they are. > > > > Thanks. > > Did we ever go through the length of making the sort of poll we had for > show-paren-mode? I think this was discussed in the past, yes. delete-selection-mode is problematic in that it introduces behavior that is extremely surprising and annoying to those who are used to the old-style GUI selections and the Emacs region. Thus, enabling it by default is out of the question; we've enabled transient-mark-mode as a partial nod to those who like the delete-selection-mode style of replacing text, but other than that, people who want that will have to enable it manually for the observable future, because we cannot possibly surprise our veteran users with such behavior. > Oh hey, well, (b) might not be off the table after all: > > > The _only_ problem I personally have with delete-selection-mode is > > that it also replaces the region created by the likes of "C-x C-x", > > something that "most software out there" does not and cannot do. If > > we were to change delete-selection-mode to replace only highlighted > > text created by mouse selections or by shift-selections, I think we > > could then enable it by default without much resistance, because > > typing a character or DEL after explicitly selecting text is many > > orders of magnitude less probable to be a mistake than when we make > > the region active by other means. > — <83o9d5q1bi.fsf@gnu.org> Note that the DEL part of the above already happens by default.