From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#48337: Fwd: 28.0.50; Emacs crashing randomly (possibly minibuffer activity related) Date: Fri, 14 May 2021 19:05:19 +0300 Message-ID: <83r1i9xpvk.fsf@gnu.org> References: <87tunasd2u.fsf@linaro.org> <83fsyu57oj.fsf@gnu.org> <838s4l5uld.fsf@gnu.org> <83zgx14cal.fsf@gnu.org> <83cztx3v04.fsf@gnu.org> <37291ae0-11cb-c817-cf26-b90ad50bfaaa@gmx.at> <425cd7715b658794b4e1@heytings.org> Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="20215"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: 48337@debbugs.gnu.org, alex.bennee@linaro.org, acm@muc.de To: Gregory Heytings Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Fri May 14 18:33:07 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1lhakM-00056w-98 for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 14 May 2021 18:33:06 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:52560 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lhakJ-00008I-UI for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 14 May 2021 12:33:04 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:48012) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lhaKA-0001F4-LC for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 14 May 2021 12:06:02 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.43]:35305) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lhaKA-0006d2-9n for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 14 May 2021 12:06:02 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lhaKA-00025S-3b for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 14 May 2021 12:06:02 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Eli Zaretskii Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 2021 16:06:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 48337 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs Original-Received: via spool by 48337-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B48337.16210083337986 (code B ref 48337); Fri, 14 May 2021 16:06:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 48337) by debbugs.gnu.org; 14 May 2021 16:05:33 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:46851 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lhaJg-00024k-Sv for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 14 May 2021 12:05:33 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:54176) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lhaJe-00024T-8E for 48337@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 14 May 2021 12:05:31 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:58332) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lhaJY-00064W-1O; Fri, 14 May 2021 12:05:24 -0400 Original-Received: from 84.94.185.95.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.95]:4091 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lhaJX-0007QY-HZ; Fri, 14 May 2021 12:05:23 -0400 In-Reply-To: <425cd7715b658794b4e1@heytings.org> (message from Gregory Heytings on Fri, 14 May 2021 15:20:11 +0000) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "bug-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:206535 Archived-At: > Date: Fri, 14 May 2021 15:20:11 +0000 > From: Gregory Heytings > cc: Eli Zaretskii , Alan Mackenzie , > 48337@debbugs.gnu.org, alex.bennee@linaro.org > > As I said to Eli a week ago or so: "So far I haven't seen a single > concrete example that demonstrates that this feature is either (a) > necessary in some circumstances (as was bidirectional editing support), or > (b) not necessary but at least useful in some circumstances." Does anyone > have such a concrete example? I'm all ears. > > It seems to me that the only benefit of this feature is a slightly > different minibuffer behavior, that some users may perhaps find more > convenient, as would be, for example, the possibility to display the > minibuffer at the top of the frames. Adding such a feature should not > make Emacs 28 backward-incompatible in any way. > > This experiment started in a bad way: its purpose was to fix a supposed > bug, which, as it turned out, was not a bug at all, but the result of a > misunderstanding, namely that isearch uses the echo area and not the > minibuffer. From then on, more and more changes were added to Emacs. We are a diverse group of people with different interests in Emacs development, each one scratching the itches that we have, which aren't necessarily itches for others. We should therefore all of us respect the interests and motivations of others, even if they scratch itches that don't look like itches to us. In this case, you have repeatedly stated your opposition to this change, and nothing positive can be expected from expressing that opposition one more time. Can you please calm down and let Alan fix whatever breakage he caused?