From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#55163: 29.0.50; master 4a1f69ebca (TICKS . HZ) for current-time broke lsp-mode Date: Sat, 30 Apr 2022 13:00:21 +0300 Message-ID: <83pmky99hm.fsf@gnu.org> References: <87sfpxxyvb.fsf@3-191.divsi.unimi.it> <87zgk5jtm6.fsf@gnus.org> <87o80kj2q1.fsf@gnus.org> <878rroi5a8.fsf@gnus.org> <83y1zo9n3o.fsf@gnu.org> <87y1zof944.fsf@gnus.org> <83wnf89mcj.fsf@gnu.org> <0a39a220-6298-8ed4-87bd-414702cd9b57@cs.ucla.edu> <83ee1facp0.fsf@gnu.org> <87tuab543p.fsf@gnus.org> Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="40870"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: v.pupillo@gmail.com, 55163@debbugs.gnu.org, eggert@cs.ucla.edu To: Lars Ingebrigtsen Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat Apr 30 12:01:47 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1nkjv9-000AVJ-Az for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 30 Apr 2022 12:01:47 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:52786 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nkjv8-0006DJ-8d for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 30 Apr 2022 06:01:46 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:56704) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nkjuQ-0006CZ-SD for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 30 Apr 2022 06:01:07 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.43]:33768) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nkjuQ-0007Gt-Hm for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 30 Apr 2022 06:01:02 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nkjuQ-00041j-Fw for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 30 Apr 2022 06:01:02 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Eli Zaretskii Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sat, 30 Apr 2022 10:01:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 55163 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs Original-Received: via spool by 55163-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B55163.165131283815441 (code B ref 55163); Sat, 30 Apr 2022 10:01:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 55163) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Apr 2022 10:00:38 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:55898 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nkju2-00040z-Cx for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 30 Apr 2022 06:00:38 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:35102) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1nkju0-00040k-4M for 55163@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 30 Apr 2022 06:00:37 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:42104) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nkjtt-0007Ee-Qh; Sat, 30 Apr 2022 06:00:29 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=7I3CiPmg5OoLDK/9/QYvbGd7hhIUhzobNO/IjTHPsPo=; b=AdROfzRAOFz0 cnVcwFYfYlhloQNVjZ5VSP1nbn1ODZR+1OGAZT/ip8cwdsdCkouxz9oAgVnoP2ToI+SjIO7bug9my LHnjEl3g8hWxX/1bLKpmtJNPkbC+H70YaHGnuUVlDJjdySw1ggQ/ii01rQ9mmwsqbJ/hP4wCVBrr5 sViOU8tJWHNAfnPOoGH3XOOJ1lzb3UBnkJdkQaIueZ0wjlWt6z6qOfCSPr9mNHPi5bhL9pEQlM7BO BZzJNNz3U+j9jWHfAR8iYpd6towRliitjUlUgXZ5IOMWOG9ix+r0vRju8zgzHzJjvnTsgsr4D2f5k /kPyInTQNHkp0370+dzWtg==; Original-Received: from [87.69.77.57] (port=3607 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nkjti-00018d-8i; Sat, 30 Apr 2022 06:00:19 -0400 In-Reply-To: <87tuab543p.fsf@gnus.org> (message from Lars Ingebrigtsen on Sat, 30 Apr 2022 11:10:18 +0200) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "bug-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:231005 Archived-At: > From: Lars Ingebrigtsen > Cc: Paul Eggert , 55163@debbugs.gnu.org, > v.pupillo@gmail.com > Date: Sat, 30 Apr 2022 11:10:18 +0200 > > Eli Zaretskii writes: > > > But before we implement a separate primitive for each attribute, we > > should ask ourselves: what are the use cases where a Lisp program > > would want to use such a primitive. Taking the file's modification > > time as an example, are there any important use cases except > > determining if a file is older or newer than another? Because we > > already have a primitive for that. > > It's common to get a list of files (including modtime) and then offer to > sort the files in various ways. That might mean we want a primitive that returns a list of files sorted by modtime, not necessarily that we want a primitive that returns just a modtime of a file. > My overall point here was simply: If we're going to institute some > interface changes in how we deal with time (in general, and I think we > probably should because of resolution and efficiency issues), it's an > opportunity to look at the wider ecosystem of functionality in this > area, and see whether we can improve other things at the same time. > `file-attributes' seems like an obvious low-hanging fruit. I agree with the general idea, but we should consider each related functionality on a case-by-case basis, and refrain from introducing new APIs just because we can, or because they could be useful in some theoretical situations. Because if we don't make these judgments, we will risk adding gobs of new APIs that rarely if ever used in practice, and the net result will be a fatter Emacs that is not more useful.