From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#42296: 27.0.91; Correct manual entry for 'concat' w.r.t. allocation [PATCH] Date: Thu, 09 Jul 2020 22:24:03 +0300 Message-ID: <83o8oopk4s.fsf@gnu.org> References: <83wo3cppc5.fsf@gnu.org> <669987BB-B825-4C2C-B9FD-31F04E0D6013@acm.org> <83r1tkplnc.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="7451"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: 42296@debbugs.gnu.org To: Mattias =?UTF-8?Q?Engdeg=C3=A5rd?= Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Thu Jul 09 21:25:14 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jtcAT-0001pQ-Rc for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 09 Jul 2020 21:25:13 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:41864 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jtcAS-00030g-Qt for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 09 Jul 2020 15:25:12 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:53886) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jtcAI-0002z0-L8 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 09 Jul 2020 15:25:02 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.43]:58401) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jtcAI-0006MJ-Bi for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 09 Jul 2020 15:25:02 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jtcAI-0004FU-8c for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 09 Jul 2020 15:25:02 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Eli Zaretskii Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Thu, 09 Jul 2020 19:25:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 42296 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: patch Original-Received: via spool by 42296-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B42296.159432266416238 (code B ref 42296); Thu, 09 Jul 2020 19:25:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 42296) by debbugs.gnu.org; 9 Jul 2020 19:24:24 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41704 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jtc9f-0004Dq-P3 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 09 Jul 2020 15:24:23 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:39912) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1jtc9d-0004Dc-Sf for 42296@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 09 Jul 2020 15:24:22 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:34462) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jtc9Y-0006IW-L1; Thu, 09 Jul 2020 15:24:16 -0400 Original-Received: from [176.228.60.248] (port=4810 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1jtc9X-0003Ad-QZ; Thu, 09 Jul 2020 15:24:16 -0400 In-Reply-To: (message from Mattias =?UTF-8?Q?Engdeg=C3=A5rd?= on Thu, 9 Jul 2020 21:17:14 +0200) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "bug-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:182876 Archived-At: > Feedback-ID:mattiase@acm.or > From: Mattias Engdegård > Date: Thu, 9 Jul 2020 21:17:14 +0200 > Cc: 42296@debbugs.gnu.org > > 9 juli 2020 kl. 20.51 skrev Eli Zaretskii : > > > That's not really what I asked for. > > Then I misunderstood; would you explain what you mean in a different way? I tried to explain that by showing the text I had in mind; I sent that a minute ago. > > And how does mutability enter the picture? We could say something > > about it (but then we'd have to be less terse), but that doesn't in > > any way replace the need to say that in many cases the value will be a > > new string, IMO. > > Sorry, but I still don't understand. What salient quality is there other than mutability? There is identity (uniqueness), but that is included as well. No user is ever worried about that the returned value may actually be a new string; it's very much the other way around. To my mind, immutability (or, rather, the adverse effects of modifying the result of 'concat') is the result of the identity. So it is conceptually wrong to talk about mutability _instead_ of the identity. Identity is the basic reason, immutability is the side effect. Which is what I tried to say in the text I suggested. Thanks.