* bug#18601: 24.3.94; set-fringe-mode with left fringe 0 breaks window width calculations on Mac OS
@ 2014-10-02 8:38 Constantine Vetoshev
2014-10-02 18:44 ` martin rudalics
0 siblings, 1 reply; 17+ messages in thread
From: Constantine Vetoshev @ 2014-10-02 8:38 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: 18601
The Emacs pretest released earlier today has a window width
calculation bug on Mac OS X when the window left fringe is turned off.
This bug is not present in the previous Emacs pretest, version
24.3.93.
The outward symptoms of this bug are similar to those #16470, fixed in
January of this year. To reproduce, do the following:
1. Start Emacs 24.3.94 (with -Q to avoid loading initialization files).
2. Execute this Elisp: (set-fringe-mode '(0 . 2))
3. Execute M-x ansi-term and select /bin/zsh as your shell.
4. Run 'ls' or any other command in the shell. Notice the spurious %
characters printed everywhere. This is the bug.
Setting the fringe to '(1 . 2) makes the problem go away.
I'm wondering if this commit is related to this bug?
http://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/emacs.git/commit/?h=emacs-24&id=984a7aaadb9c10a60621b729a86d6b13a471b92b
In GNU Emacs 24.3.94.1 (x86_64-apple-darwin13.4.0, NS apple-appkit-1265.21)
of 2014-10-01 on athena.local
Windowing system distributor `Apple', version 10.3.1265
Configured using:
`configure --with-ns'
Important settings:
value of $LC_COLLATE: C
value of $LC_CTYPE: en_US.UTF-8
value of $LANG: en_US.UTF-8
locale-coding-system: utf-8-unix
Major mode: Term
Minor modes in effect:
tooltip-mode: t
electric-indent-mode: t
mouse-wheel-mode: t
tool-bar-mode: t
menu-bar-mode: t
file-name-shadow-mode: t
global-font-lock-mode: t
font-lock-mode: t
blink-cursor-mode: t
auto-composition-mode: t
auto-encryption-mode: t
auto-compression-mode: t
line-number-mode: t
transient-mark-mode: t
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
* bug#18601: 24.3.94; set-fringe-mode with left fringe 0 breaks window width calculations on Mac OS
2014-10-02 8:38 bug#18601: 24.3.94; set-fringe-mode with left fringe 0 breaks window width calculations on Mac OS Constantine Vetoshev
@ 2014-10-02 18:44 ` martin rudalics
2014-10-02 19:22 ` Constantine Vetoshev
0 siblings, 1 reply; 17+ messages in thread
From: martin rudalics @ 2014-10-02 18:44 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Constantine Vetoshev, 18601
> The Emacs pretest released earlier today has a window width
> calculation bug on Mac OS X when the window left fringe is turned off.
> This bug is not present in the previous Emacs pretest, version
> 24.3.93.
>
> The outward symptoms of this bug are similar to those #16470, fixed in
> January of this year.
Did it work after #16470 was fixed?
> To reproduce, do the following:
>
> 1. Start Emacs 24.3.94 (with -Q to avoid loading initialization files).
> 2. Execute this Elisp: (set-fringe-mode '(0 . 2))
> 3. Execute M-x ansi-term and select /bin/zsh as your shell.
> 4. Run 'ls' or any other command in the shell. Notice the spurious %
> characters printed everywhere. This is the bug.
>
> Setting the fringe to '(1 . 2) makes the problem go away.
Please post the results of `window--dump-frame' for both the (0 . 2) and
the (1 . 2) fringes frame. I suppose the frame has only one window.
> I'm wondering if this commit is related to this bug?
> http://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/emacs.git/commit/?h=emacs-24&id=984a7aaadb9c10a60621b729a86d6b13a471b92b
To verify you could easily try using the old code instead. But I doubt
that this is related.
martin
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
* bug#18601: 24.3.94; set-fringe-mode with left fringe 0 breaks window width calculations on Mac OS
2014-10-02 18:44 ` martin rudalics
@ 2014-10-02 19:22 ` Constantine Vetoshev
2014-10-02 19:51 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-10-03 6:54 ` martin rudalics
0 siblings, 2 replies; 17+ messages in thread
From: Constantine Vetoshev @ 2014-10-02 19:22 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: martin rudalics; +Cc: 18601
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 2555 bytes --]
On Thu, Oct 2, 2014 at 11:44 AM, martin rudalics <rudalics@gmx.at> wrote:
> Did it work after #16470 was fixed?
Yes. There was no problem after #16470 was fixed. Nor was there a
problem in the last pretest, 24.3.93. The problem appeared after I
installed 24.3.94.
> Please post the results of `window--dump-frame' for both the (0 . 2) and
> the (1 . 2) fringes frame. I suppose the frame has only one window.
Yes, there is only one window and one frame. Running with -Q.
After (set-fringe-mode '(0 . 2)), executing (window--dump-frame) puts
the following contents into *window-frame-dump*:
frame pixel: 600 x 494 cols/lines: 86 x 35 units: 7 x 14
frame text pixel: 574 x 490 cols/lines: 82 x 35
tool: 0 scroll: 15 fringe: 7 border: 2 right: 0 bottom: 0
#<window 3 on *scratch*> parent: nil
pixel left: 0 top: 0 size: 596 x 476 new: 238
char left: 0 top: 0 size: 85 x 34 new: 17
normal: 1.0 x 1.0 new: 0.5
body pixel: 574 x 462 char: 82 x 33
width left fringe: 0 left margin: 0 right margin: 0
width right fringe: 7 scroll-bar: 15 divider: 0
height header-line: 0 mode-line: 14 divider: 0
#<window 4 on *Minibuf-0*> parent: nil
pixel left: 0 top: 476 size: 596 x 14 new: 0
char left: 0 top: 34 size: 596 x 1 new: 1
normal: 1.0 x 1.0 new: 0
body pixel: 574 x 14 char: 82 x 1
width left fringe: 0 left margin: 0 right margin: 0
width right fringe: 7 scroll-bar: 15 divider: 0
height header-line: 0 mode-line: 0 divider: 0
After (set-fringe-mode '(1 . 2)), executing (window--dump-frame) puts
the following contents into *window-frame-dump*:
frame pixel: 600 x 494 cols/lines: 86 x 35 units: 7 x 14
frame text pixel: 574 x 490 cols/lines: 82 x 35
tool: 0 scroll: 15 fringe: 7 border: 2 right: 0 bottom: 0
#<window 3 on *scratch*> parent: nil
pixel left: 0 top: 0 size: 596 x 476 new: 238
char left: 0 top: 0 size: 85 x 34 new: 17
normal: 1.0 x 1.0 new: 0.5
body pixel: 574 x 462 char: 82 x 33
width left fringe: 3 left margin: 0 right margin: 0
width right fringe: 4 scroll-bar: 15 divider: 0
height header-line: 0 mode-line: 14 divider: 0
#<window 4 on *Minibuf-0*> parent: nil
pixel left: 0 top: 476 size: 596 x 14 new: 0
char left: 0 top: 34 size: 596 x 1 new: 1
normal: 1.0 x 1.0 new: 0
body pixel: 574 x 14 char: 82 x 1
width left fringe: 3 left margin: 0 right margin: 0
width right fringe: 4 scroll-bar: 15 divider: 0
height header-line: 0 mode-line: 0 divider: 0
I'm attaching two screenshots which show what happens.
[-- Attachment #2: fringe-0-bad-output.png --]
[-- Type: image/png, Size: 44285 bytes --]
[-- Attachment #3: fringe-1-good-output.png --]
[-- Type: image/png, Size: 44234 bytes --]
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
* bug#18601: 24.3.94; set-fringe-mode with left fringe 0 breaks window width calculations on Mac OS
2014-10-02 19:22 ` Constantine Vetoshev
@ 2014-10-02 19:51 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-10-02 20:37 ` martin rudalics
2014-10-03 6:54 ` martin rudalics
1 sibling, 1 reply; 17+ messages in thread
From: Eli Zaretskii @ 2014-10-02 19:51 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Constantine Vetoshev; +Cc: 18601
> From: Constantine Vetoshev <vetoshev@gmail.com>
> Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2014 12:22:51 -0700
> Cc: 18601@debbugs.gnu.org
>
> I'm attaching two screenshots which show what happens.
I think this is the result of 1 column being reserved for continuation
glyph on the left (required for R2L lines). This is a "feature".
Packages that are sensitive to the number of columns in a window
should now account for this even when only the left fringe is zero.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
* bug#18601: 24.3.94; set-fringe-mode with left fringe 0 breaks window width calculations on Mac OS
2014-10-02 19:51 ` Eli Zaretskii
@ 2014-10-02 20:37 ` martin rudalics
2014-10-03 6:19 ` Eli Zaretskii
0 siblings, 1 reply; 17+ messages in thread
From: martin rudalics @ 2014-10-02 20:37 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Eli Zaretskii, Constantine Vetoshev; +Cc: 18601
> I think this is the result of 1 column being reserved for continuation
> glyph on the left (required for R2L lines). This is a "feature".
> Packages that are sensitive to the number of columns in a window
> should now account for this even when only the left fringe is zero.
Did you really change that in between 24.3.93 and 24.3.94?
martin
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
* bug#18601: 24.3.94; set-fringe-mode with left fringe 0 breaks window width calculations on Mac OS
2014-10-02 20:37 ` martin rudalics
@ 2014-10-03 6:19 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-10-03 6:55 ` martin rudalics
0 siblings, 1 reply; 17+ messages in thread
From: Eli Zaretskii @ 2014-10-03 6:19 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: martin rudalics; +Cc: 18601, vetoshev
> Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2014 22:37:16 +0200
> From: martin rudalics <rudalics@gmx.at>
> CC: 18601@debbugs.gnu.org
>
> > I think this is the result of 1 column being reserved for continuation
> > glyph on the left (required for R2L lines). This is a "feature".
> > Packages that are sensitive to the number of columns in a window
> > should now account for this even when only the left fringe is zero.
>
> Did you really change that in between 24.3.93 and 24.3.94?
Yes, in r117500. That was one part of fixing display of truncated R2L
lines in the many use cases you presented.
Btw, a simple way to avoid this side effect is to have a 1-pixel left
fringe, i.e. "pay" 1 pixel. That's not a high cost, IMO, if the
motivation for removing the left fringe is to have 1 more column
available for the same frame size.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
* bug#18601: 24.3.94; set-fringe-mode with left fringe 0 breaks window width calculations on Mac OS
2014-10-02 19:22 ` Constantine Vetoshev
2014-10-02 19:51 ` Eli Zaretskii
@ 2014-10-03 6:54 ` martin rudalics
2014-10-03 17:55 ` Constantine Vetoshev
1 sibling, 1 reply; 17+ messages in thread
From: martin rudalics @ 2014-10-03 6:54 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Constantine Vetoshev; +Cc: 18601
> After (set-fringe-mode '(0 . 2)), executing (window--dump-frame) puts
> the following contents into *window-frame-dump*:
> frame pixel: 600 x 494 cols/lines: 86 x 35 units: 7 x 14
> width left fringe: 0
> width right fringe: 7
> After (set-fringe-mode '(1 . 2)), executing (window--dump-frame) puts
> the following contents into *window-frame-dump*:
> body pixel: 574 x 462 char: 82 x 33
> width left fringe: 3
> width right fringe: 4
Here is the old fringe compensation code at work which apaprently adds 4
or 5 pixels to the specified value in order to get the sum of the widths
of the fringes equal to 7 (the frame's nominal character width). I
removed that code for NS on Emacs 25 but never did so for Emacs 24-4.
Even now I don't know whether it works correctly (see also bug #16856).
In any case I don't see why this should have any impact on what happens
in ansi-term. Apparently `term-window-width' kicks in and due to
(/= (frame-parameter nil 'right-fringe) 0))
it eventually stores in `term-width' a value that is one less than if
both fringes are present.
Since Eli now confirmed that what you observe is a result of one of his
fixes all I can suggest at the moment is to play with
(defun term-window-width ()
(if (and (not (featurep 'xemacs))
(display-graphic-p)
overflow-newline-into-fringe
(/= (frame-parameter nil 'right-fringe) 0))
(window-body-width)
(1- (window-body-width))))
What happens when you make it always return (window-body-width)?
(defun term-window-width ()
(window-body-width))
martin
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
* bug#18601: 24.3.94; set-fringe-mode with left fringe 0 breaks window width calculations on Mac OS
2014-10-03 6:19 ` Eli Zaretskii
@ 2014-10-03 6:55 ` martin rudalics
0 siblings, 0 replies; 17+ messages in thread
From: martin rudalics @ 2014-10-03 6:55 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Eli Zaretskii; +Cc: 18601, vetoshev
>> Did you really change that in between 24.3.93 and 24.3.94?
>
> Yes, in r117500. That was one part of fixing display of truncated R2L
> lines in the many use cases you presented.
Meanwhile I came to that conclusion as well ;-)
> Btw, a simple way to avoid this side effect is to have a 1-pixel left
> fringe, i.e. "pay" 1 pixel. That's not a high cost, IMO, if the
> motivation for removing the left fringe is to have 1 more column
> available for the same frame size.
This won't work on NS Emasc 24-4 which rounds pixel to column values.
martin
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
* bug#18601: 24.3.94; set-fringe-mode with left fringe 0 breaks window width calculations on Mac OS
2014-10-03 6:54 ` martin rudalics
@ 2014-10-03 17:55 ` Constantine Vetoshev
2014-10-03 18:36 ` Eli Zaretskii
0 siblings, 1 reply; 17+ messages in thread
From: Constantine Vetoshev @ 2014-10-03 17:55 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: martin rudalics; +Cc: 18601
On Thu, Oct 2, 2014 at 11:54 PM, martin rudalics <rudalics@gmx.at> wrote:
> What happens when you make it always return (window-body-width)?
>
> (defun term-window-width ()
> (window-body-width))
Tried that. The same rendering bug occurs.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
* bug#18601: 24.3.94; set-fringe-mode with left fringe 0 breaks window width calculations on Mac OS
2014-10-03 17:55 ` Constantine Vetoshev
@ 2014-10-03 18:36 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-10-03 20:53 ` Constantine Vetoshev
0 siblings, 1 reply; 17+ messages in thread
From: Eli Zaretskii @ 2014-10-03 18:36 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Constantine Vetoshev; +Cc: 18601
> From: Constantine Vetoshev <vetoshev@gmail.com>
> Date: Fri, 3 Oct 2014 10:55:29 -0700
> Cc: 18601@debbugs.gnu.org
>
> On Thu, Oct 2, 2014 at 11:54 PM, martin rudalics <rudalics@gmx.at> wrote:
> > What happens when you make it always return (window-body-width)?
> >
> > (defun term-window-width ()
> > (window-body-width))
>
> Tried that. The same rendering bug occurs.
I think you should correct term-window-width to subtract 1 from the
width when any fringe has zero width, not just the right fringe.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
* bug#18601: 24.3.94; set-fringe-mode with left fringe 0 breaks window width calculations on Mac OS
2014-10-03 18:36 ` Eli Zaretskii
@ 2014-10-03 20:53 ` Constantine Vetoshev
2014-10-04 7:08 ` Eli Zaretskii
0 siblings, 1 reply; 17+ messages in thread
From: Constantine Vetoshev @ 2014-10-03 20:53 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Eli Zaretskii; +Cc: 18601
On Fri, Oct 3, 2014 at 11:36 AM, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> wrote:
> I think you should correct term-window-width to subtract 1 from the
> width when any fringe has zero width, not just the right fringe.
I think I understand. How about this?
(defun term-window-width ()
(if (and (not (featurep ‘xemacs))
(display-graphic-p)
overflow-newline-into-fringe
(/= (frame-parameter nil ‘right-fringe) 0)
(/= (frame-parameter nil ‘left-fringe) 0))
(window-body-width)
(1- (window-body-width))))
That does make the problem go away.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
* bug#18601: 24.3.94; set-fringe-mode with left fringe 0 breaks window width calculations on Mac OS
2014-10-03 20:53 ` Constantine Vetoshev
@ 2014-10-04 7:08 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-10-04 17:45 ` Constantine Vetoshev
0 siblings, 1 reply; 17+ messages in thread
From: Eli Zaretskii @ 2014-10-04 7:08 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Constantine Vetoshev; +Cc: 18601
> From: Constantine Vetoshev <vetoshev@gmail.com>
> Date: Fri, 3 Oct 2014 13:53:03 -0700
> Cc: martin rudalics <rudalics@gmx.at>, 18601@debbugs.gnu.org
>
> On Fri, Oct 3, 2014 at 11:36 AM, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> wrote:
> > I think you should correct term-window-width to subtract 1 from the
> > width when any fringe has zero width, not just the right fringe.
>
> I think I understand. How about this?
>
> (defun term-window-width ()
> (if (and (not (featurep ‘xemacs))
> (display-graphic-p)
> overflow-newline-into-fringe
> (/= (frame-parameter nil ‘right-fringe) 0)
> (/= (frame-parameter nil ‘left-fringe) 0))
> (window-body-width)
> (1- (window-body-width))))
>
> That does make the problem go away.
That's what I meant, yes.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
* bug#18601: 24.3.94; set-fringe-mode with left fringe 0 breaks window width calculations on Mac OS
2014-10-04 7:08 ` Eli Zaretskii
@ 2014-10-04 17:45 ` Constantine Vetoshev
2014-10-04 18:49 ` Eli Zaretskii
0 siblings, 1 reply; 17+ messages in thread
From: Constantine Vetoshev @ 2014-10-04 17:45 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Eli Zaretskii; +Cc: 18601
On Sat, Oct 4, 2014 at 12:08 AM, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> wrote:
>> From: Constantine Vetoshev <vetoshev@gmail.com>
>> (defun term-window-width ()
>> (if (and (not (featurep ‘xemacs))
>> (display-graphic-p)
>> overflow-newline-into-fringe
>> (/= (frame-parameter nil ‘right-fringe) 0)
>> (/= (frame-parameter nil ‘left-fringe) 0))
>> (window-body-width)
>> (1- (window-body-width))))
>>
>> That does make the problem go away.
>
> That's what I meant, yes.
Should this be used to patch term.el?
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
* bug#18601: 24.3.94; set-fringe-mode with left fringe 0 breaks window width calculations on Mac OS
2014-10-04 17:45 ` Constantine Vetoshev
@ 2014-10-04 18:49 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-10-04 20:48 ` Constantine Vetoshev
0 siblings, 1 reply; 17+ messages in thread
From: Eli Zaretskii @ 2014-10-04 18:49 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Constantine Vetoshev; +Cc: 18601
> From: Constantine Vetoshev <vetoshev@gmail.com>
> Date: Sat, 4 Oct 2014 10:45:59 -0700
> Cc: martin rudalics <rudalics@gmx.at>, 18601@debbugs.gnu.org
>
> On Sat, Oct 4, 2014 at 12:08 AM, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> wrote:
> >> From: Constantine Vetoshev <vetoshev@gmail.com>
> >> (defun term-window-width ()
> >> (if (and (not (featurep ‘xemacs))
> >> (display-graphic-p)
> >> overflow-newline-into-fringe
> >> (/= (frame-parameter nil ‘right-fringe) 0)
> >> (/= (frame-parameter nil ‘left-fringe) 0))
> >> (window-body-width)
> >> (1- (window-body-width))))
> >>
> >> That does make the problem go away.
> >
> > That's what I meant, yes.
>
> Should this be used to patch term.el?
If it gives good results, sure.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
* bug#18601: 24.3.94; set-fringe-mode with left fringe 0 breaks window width calculations on Mac OS
2014-10-04 18:49 ` Eli Zaretskii
@ 2014-10-04 20:48 ` Constantine Vetoshev
2014-10-06 6:49 ` martin rudalics
0 siblings, 1 reply; 17+ messages in thread
From: Constantine Vetoshev @ 2014-10-04 20:48 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Eli Zaretskii; +Cc: 18601
On Sat, Oct 4, 2014 at 11:49 AM, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> wrote:
> If it gives good results, sure.
I'm happy to submit a patch, but I never signed FSF paperwork. I can
get that ball rolling, but it would surely be faster for one of you to
make the one-line change. :)
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
* bug#18601: 24.3.94; set-fringe-mode with left fringe 0 breaks window width calculations on Mac OS
2014-10-04 20:48 ` Constantine Vetoshev
@ 2014-10-06 6:49 ` martin rudalics
2014-10-06 15:10 ` Eli Zaretskii
0 siblings, 1 reply; 17+ messages in thread
From: martin rudalics @ 2014-10-06 6:49 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Constantine Vetoshev, Eli Zaretskii; +Cc: 18601-done
>> If it gives good results, sure.
>
> I'm happy to submit a patch, but I never signed FSF paperwork. I can
> get that ball rolling, but it would surely be faster for one of you to
> make the one-line change. :)
Feeling responsible for the changes leading up to this problem I've
committed the changes you proposed and apparently solve the problem
as revision 117557 of the release branch. Please have a look.
Meanwhile closing this bug, martin
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
* bug#18601: 24.3.94; set-fringe-mode with left fringe 0 breaks window width calculations on Mac OS
2014-10-06 6:49 ` martin rudalics
@ 2014-10-06 15:10 ` Eli Zaretskii
0 siblings, 0 replies; 17+ messages in thread
From: Eli Zaretskii @ 2014-10-06 15:10 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: martin rudalics; +Cc: 18601-done, vetoshev
> Date: Mon, 06 Oct 2014 08:49:24 +0200
> From: martin rudalics <rudalics@gmx.at>
> CC: 18601-done@debbugs.gnu.org
>
> >> If it gives good results, sure.
> >
> > I'm happy to submit a patch, but I never signed FSF paperwork. I can
> > get that ball rolling, but it would surely be faster for one of you to
> > make the one-line change. :)
>
> Feeling responsible for the changes leading up to this problem I've
> committed the changes you proposed and apparently solve the problem
> as revision 117557 of the release branch. Please have a look.
Thank you.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2014-10-06 15:10 UTC | newest]
Thread overview: 17+ messages (download: mbox.gz follow: Atom feed
-- links below jump to the message on this page --
2014-10-02 8:38 bug#18601: 24.3.94; set-fringe-mode with left fringe 0 breaks window width calculations on Mac OS Constantine Vetoshev
2014-10-02 18:44 ` martin rudalics
2014-10-02 19:22 ` Constantine Vetoshev
2014-10-02 19:51 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-10-02 20:37 ` martin rudalics
2014-10-03 6:19 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-10-03 6:55 ` martin rudalics
2014-10-03 6:54 ` martin rudalics
2014-10-03 17:55 ` Constantine Vetoshev
2014-10-03 18:36 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-10-03 20:53 ` Constantine Vetoshev
2014-10-04 7:08 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-10-04 17:45 ` Constantine Vetoshev
2014-10-04 18:49 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-10-04 20:48 ` Constantine Vetoshev
2014-10-06 6:49 ` martin rudalics
2014-10-06 15:10 ` Eli Zaretskii
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