From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#27505: acknowledged by developer (Re: bug#27505: LC_CTYPE affects tutorial language) Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2017 10:06:48 +0300 Message-ID: <83k22iwl13.fsf@gnu.org> References: <871soq7pyr.fsf@users.sourceforge.net> <44eb186d-db67-3e93-31cd-8260f5df7781@lausen.nl> Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1501916899 29520 195.159.176.226 (5 Aug 2017 07:08:19 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 5 Aug 2017 07:08:19 +0000 (UTC) Cc: 27505@debbugs.gnu.org To: Leonard Lausen Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Aug 05 09:08:13 2017 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ddtBv-00074v-SI for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sat, 05 Aug 2017 09:08:07 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:55634 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ddtC1-00022R-Kv for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sat, 05 Aug 2017 03:08:13 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:37972) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ddtBt-00022E-7h for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 05 Aug 2017 03:08:06 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ddtBq-0005Me-3E for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 05 Aug 2017 03:08:05 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.43]:39711) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ddtBp-0005ML-VU for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 05 Aug 2017 03:08:02 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ddtBp-0002LV-Ph for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 05 Aug 2017 03:08:01 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Eli Zaretskii Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2017 07:08:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 27505 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by 27505-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B27505.15019168268955 (code B ref 27505); Sat, 05 Aug 2017 07:08:01 +0000 Original-Received: (at 27505) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Aug 2017 07:07:06 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:42388 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ddtAw-0002KN-Hp for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 05 Aug 2017 03:07:06 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:46227) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1ddtAv-0002Js-5w for 27505@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 05 Aug 2017 03:07:05 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ddtAn-0004MY-0w for 27505@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 05 Aug 2017 03:07:00 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:34288) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ddtAm-0004MI-T5; Sat, 05 Aug 2017 03:06:56 -0400 Original-Received: from 84.94.185.246.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.246]:1090 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1ddtAm-0005jb-2e; Sat, 05 Aug 2017 03:06:56 -0400 In-reply-to: (message from Leonard Lausen on Sat, 5 Aug 2017 10:54:37 +0900) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 208.118.235.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "bug-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:135385 Archived-At: > From: Leonard Lausen > Date: Sat, 5 Aug 2017 10:54:37 +0900 > > Please reopen this bug. Continuing the discussions doesn't require reopening the bug, as long as we don't intend to make any changes for it. > In that case though I believe the intended emacs behavior does not make > sense. Given that I need to set LC_CTYPE=zh_CN.UTF-8 just to make it > possible to use input system input methods for Chinese characters > doesn't mean I want to actually use a Chinese language interface. > > Or concretely, I am learning Chinese and am comfortable typing it or > having daily conversations, however I don't feel comfortable reading the > emacs manual in Chinese. For my language learning I also tend to keep > some notes in Chinese which I would like to edit with emacs. > > Shouldn't there be a way to allow people to input Chinese (or other > non-European languages) without affecting the language environment? The > current behavior seems to discriminate language learners Yes, there should be such a way, and in fact it is already, and always was, implemented in Emacs. The values of LC_CTYPE etc. environment variables are only used to set up the _defaults_; users can use commands and options to override those defaults in many ways. For example, "C-h t" can be invoked with a numeric argument ("C-u C-h t") in which case Emacs will ask you in what language to display the tutorial. As another example, input method of your choosing can be invoked at any moment with "C-u C-\"; then you can switch it back off as soon as you've finished typing characters that are not directly accessible from your system keyboard. Finally, the language environment of your choosing can be set with "C-x RET l", and doing that will set many other defaults according to the language environment you select. Given all these facilities, I'm not sure I understand what exactly is your problem. The original report was about the tutorial language, but you never explained why did you set LC_CTYPE to the value that specified Chinese. If you did that for some reason other than for using Chinese in your programs, then perhaps you shouldn't set LC_CTYPE, and instead should use the above-mentioned, more focused, Emacs features to specify Chinese where you want it?