From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#12787: Re: bug#12787: Toolbar regression from Emacs 23 to Emacs 24 -- Save As and Help no longer available Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2012 22:00:24 +0200 Message-ID: <83hap76ahz.fsf@gnu.org> References: <8698659.1494633.1351877357323.JavaMail.root@vms170027> <10532993.1503752.1351883701083.JavaMail.root@vms170027> Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1351886479 9458 80.91.229.3 (2 Nov 2012 20:01:19 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2012 20:01:19 +0000 (UTC) Cc: 12787@debbugs.gnu.org To: jxa127@verizon.net Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Nov 02 21:01:26 2012 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1TUNQj-0005V3-I6 for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Fri, 02 Nov 2012 21:01:25 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:57445 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1TUNQb-0001aa-05 for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Fri, 02 Nov 2012 16:01:17 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:38063) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1TUNQY-0001aS-AV for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 02 Nov 2012 16:01:15 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1TUNQW-0007cY-Vc for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 02 Nov 2012 16:01:14 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.43]:35835) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1TUNQW-0007cT-S8 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 02 Nov 2012 16:01:12 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1TUNTG-0007xR-AY for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 02 Nov 2012 16:04:02 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Eli Zaretskii Original-Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2012 20:04:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 12787 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by 12787-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B12787.135188661130550 (code B ref 12787); Fri, 02 Nov 2012 20:04:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 12787) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Nov 2012 20:03:31 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:46086 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1TUNSl-0007wh-F4 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 02 Nov 2012 16:03:31 -0400 Original-Received: from mtaout23.012.net.il ([80.179.55.175]:35169) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1TUNSi-0007wZ-JR for 12787@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 02 Nov 2012 16:03:30 -0400 Original-Received: from conversion-daemon.a-mtaout23.012.net.il by a-mtaout23.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) id <0MCV00A00LUQE600@a-mtaout23.012.net.il> for 12787@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 02 Nov 2012 22:00:37 +0200 (IST) Original-Received: from HOME-C4E4A596F7 ([87.69.4.28]) by a-mtaout23.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) with ESMTPA id <0MCV00ATGM90EA10@a-mtaout23.012.net.il>; Fri, 02 Nov 2012 22:00:37 +0200 (IST) In-reply-to: <10532993.1503752.1351883701083.JavaMail.root@vms170027> X-012-Sender: halo1@inter.net.il X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6.x X-Received-From: 140.186.70.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:66358 Archived-At: > Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2012 14:15:00 -0500 (CDT) > From: jxa127@verizon.net > Cc: 12787@debbugs.gnu.org > > On 11/02/12, Glenn Morris wrote: > > >jxa127@verizon.net wrote: > > > >> I save tool-bar.el, compile it to tool-bar.elc and then restart Emacs, > >> but the buttons are not there. > > > >This file is dumped into the Emacs executable, so you would need to > >rebuild Emacs with your changes. I imagine it would be much simpler to > >just add the buttons in your init file. I don't use the tool-bar and > >have no real opinion on what buttons should be there; but "Help" seems > >too general, rarely used, and hence a waste of space to me. Same with > >"save as" I guess. > > I see your point, however the fact remains that this is a regression from Emacs 23 -- and a seemingly arbitrary one at that -- that wasn't mentioned in the NEWS. What is a regression? tool-bar.el was always preloaded and dumped into the Emacs executable. There's no change here. > I get that "real" Emacs users don't use the tool bar (or the menu bar, for that matter), but I've been using Emacs extensively for seven years now and still find uses for the tool-bar. "Save As" is for me exceptionally useful. Well, those "real" users are those who decided to code the tool bar and the menu bar, and to have it by default in Emacs. So I think this is misdirected.