From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED.ciao.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#34150: 26.1; Document filtering with `isearch-filter-predicate' in Elisp manual Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2019 21:05:19 +0200 Message-ID: <83ef95al1s.fsf@gnu.org> References: <<8c207ca2-39ae-4ec1-acbd-358165964319@default>> <<83o98a9e2l.fsf@gnu.org>> <<8c88ff94-e322-4754-b74a-c792512ec277@default>> <<83h8e1amsu.fsf@gnu.org>> <208f2037-8fa0-4475-a9cf-b2417613af5c@default> Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.org; posting-host="ciao.gmane.org:195.159.176.228"; logging-data="188110"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.org" Cc: 34150@debbugs.gnu.org To: Drew Adams Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Jan 21 20:07:26 2019 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1gleur-000mr5-PS for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Mon, 21 Jan 2019 20:07:25 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:58267 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1gleuq-0007qS-H2 for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Mon, 21 Jan 2019 14:07:24 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:38654) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1gleuc-0007jF-9y for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 21 Jan 2019 14:07:11 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1gletW-0002GC-Vp for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 21 Jan 2019 14:06:03 -0500 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.43]:41187) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1gletW-0002G5-SW for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 21 Jan 2019 14:06:02 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1gletW-0005Vk-Jk for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 21 Jan 2019 14:06:02 -0500 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Eli Zaretskii Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2019 19:06:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 34150 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs Original-Received: via spool by 34150-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B34150.154809754721145 (code B ref 34150); Mon, 21 Jan 2019 19:06:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 34150) by debbugs.gnu.org; 21 Jan 2019 19:05:47 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:40465 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1gletH-0005Uz-7b for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 21 Jan 2019 14:05:47 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:56362) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1gletF-0005Ul-7Z for 34150@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 21 Jan 2019 14:05:46 -0500 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:42852) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1glet5-000236-Uo; Mon, 21 Jan 2019 14:05:37 -0500 Original-Received: from [176.228.60.248] (port=3956 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1glet3-000108-Rh; Mon, 21 Jan 2019 14:05:35 -0500 In-reply-to: <208f2037-8fa0-4475-a9cf-b2417613af5c@default> (message from Drew Adams on Mon, 21 Jan 2019 10:40:36 -0800 (PST)) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 209.51.188.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "bug-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:154653 Archived-At: > Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2019 10:40:36 -0800 (PST) > From: Drew Adams > Cc: 34150@debbugs.gnu.org > > > > But it and its consequences are not necessarily > > > obvious - especially to a user searching, as opposed > > > to a programmer writing a filter predicate. > > > > This is not a user-level facility, so the user perspective is not > > relevant. > > The "user perspective" is always relevant for Emacs. > We are all users. > > Searching is a user-level facility. If a search > imposes/provides filtering, that certainly affects > user-visible behavior. Users should understand > that behavior. > > Anyone imposing such filtering on users should > consider its effects on users, including the > considerations raised by this bug report. That > starts with making the behavior and consequences > clear to filter implementors. All true, but the filtering itself is not on the user level: the _results_ of the filtering are. So the behavior on the user level should be described and understood by users in higher-level terms. For example, with the default filtering, the behavior should be described in terms of searching inside invisible text, not in terms of filtering out some of the hits; the latter is just the implementation, not the user-level behavior. Therefore, the details of how filtering of matches works, and how to write a filter, is not user-level information. If you re-read what you wrote above, you will see that your arguments are all consistent with what I said, they don;'t contradict that in any way.