From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#67196: M-: uses a wrong value of debug-on-error when it is nil. Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2023 13:15:15 +0200 Message-ID: <83edgecce4.fsf@gnu.org> References: <83a5rfq6i2.fsf@gnu.org> <83ttpbdm2f.fsf@gnu.org> <83il5qe00e.fsf@gnu.org> Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="15987"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: 67196@debbugs.gnu.org, monnier@iro.umontreal.ca To: Alan Mackenzie Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat Nov 25 12:17:02 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1r6qek-0003yB-Gg for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 25 Nov 2023 12:17:02 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1r6qdr-00029K-Le; Sat, 25 Nov 2023 06:16:07 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1r6qdh-00026L-VI for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 25 Nov 2023 06:15:58 -0500 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:5::43]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1r6qdh-0000yZ-Me for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 25 Nov 2023 06:15:57 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1r6qdl-00018V-MH for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 25 Nov 2023 06:16:01 -0500 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Eli Zaretskii Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2023 11:16:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 67196 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs Original-Received: via spool by 67196-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B67196.17009109502779 (code B ref 67196); Sat, 25 Nov 2023 11:16:01 +0000 Original-Received: (at 67196) by debbugs.gnu.org; 25 Nov 2023 11:15:50 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:37999 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1r6qda-0000ho-0y for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 25 Nov 2023 06:15:50 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:50830) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1r6qdY-0000TH-FS for 67196@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 25 Nov 2023 06:15:49 -0500 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1r6qdM-0000nE-92; Sat, 25 Nov 2023 06:15:36 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=zWdbb7DqkhuITMfSG2iKNh0jCcoaACOakEecJUOvoK0=; b=f52wZ2AIm87p ywSEkAWJvquqPIthbpDE7khsFDcMm6oocfMNfFPSw/hDX9BU5XlYyqQRDWKVJ+zf7dTNMCm6P1cSG EaJbRVMNuoOn0sJkucNNaPT3QRJ9jImgPYdX3nWb7IxaR09Nv7tvK1BVSKbuTeICPpNDNeYmAc/V3 hPbPHDdt2end4mHXdf9YDRgWAmrnHIblE6O6u78W7O5o14SAb/B2S64GyyqosZFE9Ny3v43+2X/wm vsiOMIuHHyErV0LOh45HElKNlHYdFc8BzQO1ZSJoT9MRaKUoCeKP4JYZcvy13hnV9yHDetDmsUfpM HcJpPpaVGsduHj4EZShP7w==; In-Reply-To: (message from Alan Mackenzie on Sat, 25 Nov 2023 10:32:23 +0000) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:274957 Archived-At: > Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2023 10:32:23 +0000 > Cc: monnier@iro.umontreal.ca, 67196@debbugs.gnu.org > From: Alan Mackenzie > > > How about not exposing the internal variable to Lisp at all? > > That's a very good idea. It would need little more than a new C function > which would bind that variable then call eval. Maybe move > eval-expression-debug-on-error into eval.c, too. What I had in mind was a function exposed to Lisp that would set an internal variable not exposed to Lisp. > > > For what it's worth, I lost about 10 hours of time trying to debug > > > a situation where I wasn't getting a backtrace, despite debug-on-error > > > being t. The problem was that d-o-e wasn't t at all, it was nil. M-: > > > had been lying. > > > You never described that situation, AFAICT. I think you should, so > > that we could assess how grave the problem is, which is an important > > part of deciding whether the solution you propose is useful. I don't > > understand how could you NOT get a backtrace when debug-on-error is > > non-nil. > > Sorry, I wasn't clear enough. During those 10 hours, I was under the > impression that debug-on-error was t, because M-: debug-on-error said so. > It actually was nil. That's why I submitted this bug report. So maybe instead of changing how this stuff works we should improve how debug-on-error's value is reported by M-: and other eval commands? Note that (AFAIU) your change doesn't just solve the problem you bumped into, it also changes the value of debug-on-error inside eval-expression etc., when eval-expression-debug-on-error's value is non-nil, but not t. I wonder what is the reason for that?