From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#2975: texinfo-master-menu and emacs.texi Date: Sat, 10 Dec 2011 12:57:09 +0200 Message-ID: <83borgn18a.fsf@gnu.org> References: <201112100017.pBA0Hf4Y028604@sls-af11p1.sea2.superbservers.com> Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1323514691 31508 80.91.229.12 (10 Dec 2011 10:58:11 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 10 Dec 2011 10:58:11 +0000 (UTC) Cc: stepnem@gmail.com, winkler@gnu.org, 2975@debbugs.gnu.org To: karl@freefriends.org (Karl Berry) Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Dec 10 11:58:06 2011 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([140.186.70.17]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RZKd4-00054s-C1 for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sat, 10 Dec 2011 11:58:06 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:39468 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1RZKd4-0000be-0S for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sat, 10 Dec 2011 05:58:06 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.92]:37419) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1RZKd1-0000bM-42 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 10 Dec 2011 05:58:04 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1RZKd0-0005XU-BA for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 10 Dec 2011 05:58:03 -0500 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.43]:60235) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1RZKd0-0005XQ-8N for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 10 Dec 2011 05:58:02 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RZKdx-0000Ib-SA for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 10 Dec 2011 05:59:01 -0500 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Eli Zaretskii Original-Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sat, 10 Dec 2011 10:59:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 2975 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by 2975-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B2975.13235146931031 (code B ref 2975); Sat, 10 Dec 2011 10:59:01 +0000 Original-Received: (at 2975) by debbugs.gnu.org; 10 Dec 2011 10:58:13 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RZKdB-0000Ga-92 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 10 Dec 2011 05:58:13 -0500 Original-Received: from mtaout23.012.net.il ([80.179.55.175]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RZKd9-0000GO-GA for 2975@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 10 Dec 2011 05:58:12 -0500 Original-Received: from conversion-daemon.a-mtaout23.012.net.il by a-mtaout23.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) id <0LVZ00400IEQDD00@a-mtaout23.012.net.il> for 2975@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 10 Dec 2011 12:57:10 +0200 (IST) Original-Received: from HOME-C4E4A596F7 ([84.228.102.96]) by a-mtaout23.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) with ESMTPA id <0LVZ004RDIF8CP20@a-mtaout23.012.net.il>; Sat, 10 Dec 2011 12:57:10 +0200 (IST) In-reply-to: <201112100017.pBA0Hf4Y028604@sls-af11p1.sea2.superbservers.com> X-012-Sender: halo1@inter.net.il X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list Resent-Date: Sat, 10 Dec 2011 05:59:01 -0500 X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) X-Received-From: 140.186.70.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:54857 Archived-At: > Date: Fri, 9 Dec 2011 16:17:41 -0800 > From: karl@freefriends.org (Karl Berry) > Cc: stepnem@gmail.com, eliz@gnu.org, 2975@debbugs.gnu.org > > > So, given that makeinfo can add the info itself when needed, is there > > really ever any need for listing the node pointers explicitly at all? > > If Karl or whoever could answer this question with a clear "no, these > node pointers are never needed" > > I believe Eli answered this, but to reiterate, it is only (very) > exceptional manuals which might need node pointers. > > So if you're asking if texinfo-mode needs to keep supporting them, I > would say, definitely not. In fact, I think it would be a good thing if > it didn't. I have seen many authors have unnecessary problems due to > texinfo-mode inserting the node pointers. I updated the commentary and the doc strings of the relevant functions in texnfo-upd.el to the effect that texinfo-update-node and the commands that call it should only be used if one knows what they are doing. I also made texinfo-master-menu call texinfo-update-node only if the prefix arg is numeric, because invoking texinfo-master-menu with just C-u is still useful and much less problematic. I decided not to remove the code that updates the @node lines entirely, since texinfo-update-node could still be useful to experts in very specialized use cases. I also added to the doc strings of relevant commands a note about non-support of multi-file Texinfo manuals, and a reference to texinfo-multiple-files-update, which does. I hope this makes the situation quite a bit better.