bug#23074: 25.1.50; X11: `use-fancy-splash-screens-p` erroneously returns nil.

bug#23074: 25.1.50; X11: `use-fancy-splash-screens-p` erroneously returns nil.

[Keith David Bershatsky]

Emacs master branch built `--with-x --with-ns=no` with full image support on an OSX machine (10.6.8) does not display the Emacs logo on the Welcome screen because the final test of `use-fancy-splash-screen-p` returns nil.  If we use 17 instead of 19, the test returns `t` and the Emacs logo is displayed.

I would suggest using a better test like `one-window-p`, because 19 is too big.

    (defun use-fancy-splash-screens-p ()
      "Return t if fancy splash screens should be used."
      (when (and (display-graphic-p)
                 (or (and (display-color-p)
              (image-type-available-p 'xpm))
                     (image-type-available-p 'pbm)))
        (let ((frame (fancy-splash-frame)))
          (when frame
      (let* ((img (create-image (fancy-splash-image-file)))
             (image-height (and img (cdr (image-size img nil frame))))
             ;; We test frame-height so that, if the frame is split
             ;; by displaying a warning, that doesn't cause the normal
             ;; splash screen to be used.
             (frame-height (1- (frame-height frame))))
       ;; The original value added to the `image-height' for the test was 19; however,
       ;; that causes the test to fail on X11 by about 1.5 -- so use 17 instead.
        (> frame-height (+ image-height 17)))))))

Thanks,

Keith

bug#23074: 25.1.50; X11: `use-fancy-splash-screens-p` erroneously returns nil.

[Eli Zaretskii]

> Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2016 22:08:43 -0700
> From: Keith David Bershatsky <esq@lawlist.com>
> 
> Emacs master branch built `--with-x --with-ns=no` with full image support on an OSX machine (10.6.8) does not display the Emacs logo on the Welcome screen because the final test of `use-fancy-splash-screen-p` returns nil.  If we use 17 instead of 19, the test returns `t` and the Emacs logo is displayed.
> 
> I would suggest using a better test like `one-window-p`, because 19 is too big.
> 
>     (defun use-fancy-splash-screens-p ()
>       "Return t if fancy splash screens should be used."
>       (when (and (display-graphic-p)
>                  (or (and (display-color-p)
>               (image-type-available-p 'xpm))
>                      (image-type-available-p 'pbm)))
>         (let ((frame (fancy-splash-frame)))
>           (when frame
>       (let* ((img (create-image (fancy-splash-image-file)))
>              (image-height (and img (cdr (image-size img nil frame))))
>              ;; We test frame-height so that, if the frame is split
>              ;; by displaying a warning, that doesn't cause the normal
>              ;; splash screen to be used.
>              (frame-height (1- (frame-height frame))))
>        ;; The original value added to the `image-height' for the test was 19; however,
>        ;; that causes the test to fail on X11 by about 1.5 -- so use 17 instead.
>         (> frame-height (+ image-height 17)))))))

I would like to understand the situation before discussing the
solution.  Please tell what these two evaluations yield in "emacs -q":

  M-: (frame-height) RET
  M-: (image-size (create-image (fancy-splash-image-file))) RET

On my system, the first one produces 35, the second (41.625 . 14.5625).

Thanks.

bug#23074: 25.1.50; X11: `use-fancy-splash-screens-p` erroneously returns nil.

[Keith David Bershatsky]

The following test was performed with no toolkit -- i.e., --with-x --with-x-toolkit=no --with-ns=no

M-: (frame-height) RET

  Evaluating the above gives me a value of 35.


M-: (image-size (create-image (fancy-splash-image-file))) RET

  Evaluating the above gives me a value of:  (41.625 . 15.533333333333333)


The value for `fancy-splash-image-file` is:  "splash.svg"


Keith

;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;

At Mon, 21 Mar 2016 18:03:24 +0200,
Eli Zaretskii wrote:
> 
> ***
> 
> I would like to understand the situation before discussing the
> solution.  Please tell what these two evaluations yield in "emacs -q":
> 
>   M-: (frame-height) RET
>   M-: (image-size (create-image (fancy-splash-image-file))) RET
> 
> On my system, the first one produces 35, the second (41.625 . 14.5625).
> 
> Thanks.

bug#23074: 25.1.50; X11: `use-fancy-splash-screens-p` erroneously returns nil.

[Eli Zaretskii]

> Date:  Mon, 21 Mar 2016 18:03:21 -0700
> From:  Keith David Bershatsky <esq@lawlist.com>
> Cc:  23074@debbugs.gnu.org
> 
> The following test was performed with no toolkit -- i.e., --with-x 
> --with-x-toolkit=no --with-ns=no
> 
> M-: (frame-height) RET
> 
>   Evaluating the above gives me a value of 35.
> 
> M-: (image-size (create-image (fancy-splash-image-file))) RET
> 
>   Evaluating the above gives me a value of:  (41.625 . 15.533333333333333)
> 
> The value for `fancy-splash-image-file` is:  "splash.svg"

Then, with the code you modified in startup.el, you do succeed to get
the fancy splash image, but the text below it is only partially
visible, right?  IOW, one or two (maybe even 3) last lines are not
visible?  This is exactly what the test was trying to avoid.  So if we
go with your proposal, it is not clear why we should insist on some
minimal frame height at all.

(Or maybe you don't have auto-save file lists in your home directory,
in which case your startup screen shows 2 lines less than it does on
my system, and you are not aware of the problem for that reason.)

I think the correct solution will be to increase the default frame
size by 1 or maybe even 2 lines.  Because on my system, the last line
is only partially visible, so the calculation in
use-fancy-splash-screens-p is slightly inaccurate (because it is
off-by-one -- we need to subtract 2 from the frame height, not 1).

bug#23074: 25.1.50; X11: `use-fancy-splash-screens-p` erroneously returns nil.

[Keith David Bershatsky]

With the modification that I made in startup.el -- building with the default gtk3 toolkit -- the fancy image takes up a substantial portion of the welcome screen such that the last partially visible line is:  "Auto-save file lists were found.  If an Emacs session crashed recently,"

I had assumed based on the comments in the function that I modified that the concern was a potential second window displaying an error message.  If the error message is displayed in that second window, then suppress the image in the welcome screen.  That is why I suggested the idea of a `one-window-p` test to determine whether an error window might be displayed.

Your idea of having all text visible in the welcome screen makes good sense.  I haven't familiarized myself with everything that goes into determining the initial default frame size or default size of subsequently created frames.  So, I have no opinion regarding what the default should be.  I also have no opinion regarding the text that makes up the contents of the welcome screen.

My primary concern when building Emacs was that perhaps I did not have proper image support because the Emacs logo was not appearing.  But, that concern has now been resolved by tracking it down to use-fancy-splash-screens-p.

Keith

;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;

At Tue, 22 Mar 2016 18:07:18 +0200,
Eli Zaretskii wrote:
> 
> * * *
> 
> Then, with the code you modified in startup.el, you do succeed to get
> the fancy splash image, but the text below it is only partially
> visible, right?  IOW, one or two (maybe even 3) last lines are not
> visible?  This is exactly what the test was trying to avoid.  So if we
> go with your proposal, it is not clear why we should insist on some
> minimal frame height at all.
> 
> (Or maybe you don't have auto-save file lists in your home directory,
> in which case your startup screen shows 2 lines less than it does on
> my system, and you are not aware of the problem for that reason.)
> 
> I think the correct solution will be to increase the default frame
> size by 1 or maybe even 2 lines.  Because on my system, the last line
> is only partially visible, so the calculation in
> use-fancy-splash-screens-p is slightly inaccurate (because it is
> off-by-one -- we need to subtract 2 from the frame height, not 1).

bug#23074: 25.1.50; X11: `use-fancy-splash-screens-p` erroneously returns nil.

[Eli Zaretskii]

> Date:  Tue, 22 Mar 2016 19:04:06 -0700
> From:  Keith David Bershatsky <esq@lawlist.com>
> Cc:  23074@debbugs.gnu.org
> 
> With the modification that I made in startup.el -- building with the default gtk3 toolkit -- the fancy image takes up a substantial portion of the welcome screen such that the last partially visible line is:  "Auto-save file lists were found.  If an Emacs session crashed recently,"

Yes, that's what I expected to happen.

> I had assumed based on the comments in the function that I modified that the concern was a potential second window displaying an error message.  If the error message is displayed in that second window, then suppress the image in the welcome screen.  That is why I suggested the idea of a `one-window-p` test to determine whether an error window might be displayed.

I fixed the comment to make itself more clear.

> Your idea of having all text visible in the welcome screen makes good sense.  I haven't familiarized myself with everything that goes into determining the initial default frame size or default size of subsequently created frames.  So, I have no opinion regarding what the default should be.  I also have no opinion regarding the text that makes up the contents of the welcome screen.

Please try the latest emacs-25 branch, without your local
modifications to startup.el.  If you still don't get the splash image
displayed, it's possible that the default height of the initial GUI
frame should be enlarged in some Emacs configurations.  In that case,
I would ask you to kindly test this issue in different builds you have
with different GUI toolkits, and tell which one(s) have the problem,
so that the condition for the frame size could be correctly
formulated.

Thanks.

bug#23074: 25.1.50; X11: `use-fancy-splash-screens-p` erroneously returns nil.

[Keith David Bershatsky]

Here are four (4) X11 configuration options (built on an OSX box) and corresponding frame-height values.

None of the four (4) options tested display the Emacs logo splash image.


Emacs 25:  --with-x [no toolkit configuration] = the default is `gtk3`
  (frame-height) = 36

Emacs 25:  --with-x --with-x-toolkit=athena
  (frame-height) = 35

Emacs 25:  --with-x --with-x-toolkit=motif
  (frame-height) = 35

Emacs 25:  --with-x --with-x-toolkit=no
  (frame-height) = 36


Keith

;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;

At Fri, 25 Mar 2016 10:49:59 +0300,
Eli Zaretskii wrote:
> 
>  * * *
> 
> Please try the latest emacs-25 branch, without your local
> modifications to startup.el.  If you still don't get the splash image
> displayed, it's possible that the default height of the initial GUI
> frame should be enlarged in some Emacs configurations.  In that case,
> I would ask you to kindly test this issue in different builds you have
> with different GUI toolkits, and tell which one(s) have the problem,
> so that the condition for the frame size could be correctly
> formulated.
> 
> Thanks.

bug#23074: 25.1.50; X11: `use-fancy-splash-screens-p` erroneously returns nil.

[Eli Zaretskii]

> Date:  Sat, 26 Mar 2016 21:04:27 -0700
> From:  Keith David Bershatsky <esq@lawlist.com>
> Cc:  23074@debbugs.gnu.org
> 
> Here are four (4) X11 configuration options (built on an OSX box) and corresponding frame-height values.
> 
> None of the four (4) options tested display the Emacs logo splash image.
> 
> 
> Emacs 25:  --with-x [no toolkit configuration] = the default is `gtk3`
>   (frame-height) = 36
> 
> Emacs 25:  --with-x --with-x-toolkit=athena
>   (frame-height) = 35
> 
> Emacs 25:  --with-x --with-x-toolkit=motif
>   (frame-height) = 35
> 
> Emacs 25:  --with-x --with-x-toolkit=no
>   (frame-height) = 36

Please also tell what does image-size return for the splash image in
each case.

Thanks.

bug#23074: 25.1.50; X11: `use-fancy-splash-screens-p` erroneously returns nil.

[Eli Zaretskii]

> Date:  Sat, 26 Mar 2016 21:04:27 -0700
> From:  Keith David Bershatsky <esq@lawlist.com>
> Cc:  23074@debbugs.gnu.org
> 
> Here are four (4) X11 configuration options (built on an OSX box) and corresponding frame-height values.
> 
> None of the four (4) options tested display the Emacs logo splash image.
> 
> 
> Emacs 25:  --with-x [no toolkit configuration] = the default is `gtk3`
>   (frame-height) = 36
> 
> Emacs 25:  --with-x --with-x-toolkit=athena
>   (frame-height) = 35
> 
> Emacs 25:  --with-x --with-x-toolkit=motif
>   (frame-height) = 35
> 
> Emacs 25:  --with-x --with-x-toolkit=no
>   (frame-height) = 36

I asked what does image-size return for the splash image in each case.
Could you please provide that information?  TIA.

bug#23074: 25.1.50; X11: `use-fancy-splash-screens-p` erroneously returns nil.

[Keith David Bershatsky]

Yes, I'd be happy to check that and I'll also check what kind of image is being used -- I would imagine that the image depends upon the image support available at the time of building, and also image libraries available once it is built (to support displaying a particular image) -- e.g., svg.

I'm running out the door now, but can take care of this later this evening or tomorrow morning at the latest.  Sorry for the delay.

Keith



On Apr 8, 2016, at 1:30 AM, Eli Zaretskii wrote:

>> Date:  Sat, 26 Mar 2016 21:04:27 -0700
>> From:  Keith David Bershatsky <esq@lawlist.com>
>> Cc:  23074@debbugs.gnu.org
>> 
>> Here are four (4) X11 configuration options (built on an OSX box) and corresponding frame-height values.
>> 
>> None of the four (4) options tested display the Emacs logo splash image.
>> 
>> 
>> Emacs 25:  --with-x [no toolkit configuration] = the default is `gtk3`
>>  (frame-height) = 36
>> 
>> Emacs 25:  --with-x --with-x-toolkit=athena
>>  (frame-height) = 35
>> 
>> Emacs 25:  --with-x --with-x-toolkit=motif
>>  (frame-height) = 35
>> 
>> Emacs 25:  --with-x --with-x-toolkit=no
>>  (frame-height) = 36
> 
> I asked what does image-size return for the splash image in each case.
> Could you please provide that information?  TIA.

bug#23074: 25.1.50; X11: `use-fancy-splash-screens-p` erroneously returns nil.

[Keith David Bershatsky]

In all four (4) cases tested this evening with the current emacs-25 branch (April 8, 2016), the `splash.svg` image is used and it has the same dimensions in all four situations tested:  (41.625 . 15.533333333333333).

I have not experimented with removing svg support while trying to maintain support for other possible image types -- e.g., splash.pbm, splash.png or splash.xpm.

Emacs 25:  --with-x --with-x-toolkit=no
  (frame-height) = 36
  splash.svg:  (41.625 . 15.533333333333333)

Emacs 25:  --with-x --with-x-toolkit=gtk3
  (frame-height) = 36
  splash.svg:  (41.625 . 15.533333333333333)

Emacs 25:  --with-x --with-x-toolkit=motif
  (frame-height) = 35
  splash.svg:  (41.625 . 15.533333333333333)

Emacs 25:  --with-x --with-x-toolkit=athena
  (frame-height) = 35
  splash.svg:  (41.625 . 15.533333333333333)

Keith

;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;

At Fri, 08 Apr 2016 11:30:28 +0300,
Eli Zaretskii wrote:
> 
>  X11: `use-fancy-splash-screens-p` erroneously returns nil.
> 
> > Date:  Sat, 26 Mar 2016 21:04:27 -0700
> > From:  Keith David Bershatsky <esq@lawlist.com>
> > Cc:  23074@debbugs.gnu.org
> > 
> > Here are four (4) X11 configuration options (built on an OSX box) and corresponding frame-height values.
> > 
> > None of the four (4) options tested display the Emacs logo splash image.
> > 
> > 
> > Emacs 25:  --with-x [no toolkit configuration] = the default is `gtk3`
> >   (frame-height) = 36
> > 
> > Emacs 25:  --with-x --with-x-toolkit=athena
> >   (frame-height) = 35
> > 
> > Emacs 25:  --with-x --with-x-toolkit=motif
> >   (frame-height) = 35
> > 
> > Emacs 25:  --with-x --with-x-toolkit=no
> >   (frame-height) = 36
> 
> I asked what does image-size return for the splash image in each case.
> Could you please provide that information?  TIA.

bug#23074: 25.1.50; X11: `use-fancy-splash-screens-p` erroneously returns nil.

[Eli Zaretskii]

> Date:  Fri, 08 Apr 2016 23:48:13 -0700
> From:  Keith David Bershatsky <esq@lawlist.com>
> Cc:  23074@debbugs.gnu.org
> 
> In all four (4) cases tested this evening with the current emacs-25 branch (April 8, 2016), the `splash.svg` image is used and it has the same dimensions in all four situations tested:  (41.625 . 15.533333333333333).

Thanks.  This means the initial frame needs to be enlarged by one more
line.

However, I wonder whether this is what all OS X users see, or just
something specific to your system.  Can someone else please repeat
these experiments on OS X and report the results?  John?  Anyone?

Here's the recipe to be evaluated in *scratch* in "emacs -Q":

  (let* ((img (create-image (fancy-splash-image-file)))
	 (image-height (and img (cdr (image-size img nil)))))
    (message "%s" image-height))

> I have not experimented with removing svg support while trying to maintain support for other possible image types -- e.g., splash.pbm, splash.png or splash.xpm.

I don't think this matters, all the images will have the same size.

bug#23074: 25.1.50; X11: `use-fancy-splash-screens-p` erroneously returns nil.

[Eli Zaretskii]

Ping!  I'd like to fix this problem for Emacs 25.1, if possible.

> Date: Sat, 09 Apr 2016 10:53:02 +0300
> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>
> Cc: 23074@debbugs.gnu.org
> 
> > Date:  Fri, 08 Apr 2016 23:48:13 -0700
> > From:  Keith David Bershatsky <esq@lawlist.com>
> > Cc:  23074@debbugs.gnu.org
> > 
> > In all four (4) cases tested this evening with the current emacs-25 branch (April 8, 2016), the `splash.svg` image is used and it has the same dimensions in all four situations tested:  (41.625 . 15.533333333333333).
> 
> Thanks.  This means the initial frame needs to be enlarged by one more
> line.
> 
> However, I wonder whether this is what all OS X users see, or just
> something specific to your system.  Can someone else please repeat
> these experiments on OS X and report the results?  John?  Anyone?
> 
> Here's the recipe to be evaluated in *scratch* in "emacs -Q":
> 
>   (let* ((img (create-image (fancy-splash-image-file)))
> 	 (image-height (and img (cdr (image-size img nil)))))
>     (message "%s" image-height))
> 
> > I have not experimented with removing svg support while trying to maintain support for other possible image types -- e.g., splash.pbm, splash.png or splash.xpm.
> 
> I don't think this matters, all the images will have the same size.
> 
> 
> 
> 

bug#23074: 25.1.50; X11: `use-fancy-splash-screens-p` erroneously returns nil.

[Stefan Kangas]

Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> writes:

> Ping!  I'd like to fix this problem for Emacs 25.1, if possible.
>
>> Date: Sat, 09 Apr 2016 10:53:02 +0300
>> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>
>> Cc: 23074@debbugs.gnu.org
>>
>> > Date:  Fri, 08 Apr 2016 23:48:13 -0700
>> > From:  Keith David Bershatsky <esq@lawlist.com>
>> > Cc:  23074@debbugs.gnu.org
>> >
>> > In all four (4) cases tested this evening with the current emacs-25 branch (April 8, 2016), the `splash.svg` image is used and it has the same dimensions in all four situations tested:  (41.625 . 15.533333333333333).
>>
>> Thanks.  This means the initial frame needs to be enlarged by one more
>> line.
>>
>> However, I wonder whether this is what all OS X users see, or just
>> something specific to your system.  Can someone else please repeat
>> these experiments on OS X and report the results?  John?  Anyone?
>>
>> Here's the recipe to be evaluated in *scratch* in "emacs -Q":
>>
>>   (let* ((img (create-image (fancy-splash-image-file)))
>> 	 (image-height (and img (cdr (image-size img nil)))))
>>     (message "%s" image-height))
>>
>> > I have not experimented with removing svg support while trying to maintain support for other possible image types -- e.g., splash.pbm, splash.png or splash.xpm.
>>
>> I don't think this matters, all the images will have the same size.

More information was requested, but none was given within 4 years, so
I'm closing this bug.  If this is still an issue, please reply to this
email (use "Reply to all" in your email client) and we can reopen the
bug report.

Best regards,
Stefan Kangas

bug#23074: 25.1.50; X11: `use-fancy-splash-screens-p` erroneously returns nil.

[John Hawkinson]

Sorry for the necropost; I hope this reopens properly.

Stefan Kangas <stefan@marxist.se> wrote on Sat, 15 Aug 2020
at 00:22:16 EDT in <CADwFkmk6adGnng8-8eTVtth=8tRTyFEwuWKBvFGkhkG+pptb4g@mail.gmail.com>:

> Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> writes:
> 
> > Ping!  I'd like to fix this problem for Emacs 25.1, if possible.
...
> More information was requested, but none was given within 4 years, so
> I'm closing this bug.  If this is still an issue, please reply to this
> email (use "Reply to all" in your email client) and we can reopen the
> bug report.

This is still an issue, I think. I upgraded from Emacs 24.3 to 27.2 this morning, and the first thing I noticed was the missing splash screen graphic.

Notably,
https://emacs.stackexchange.com/questions/20976/x11-why-is-the-emacs-logo-image-missing-on-the-welcome-screen
recommends adjusting use-fancy-splash-screens-p's calculation constants, so I suspect that may be what a lot of people do.

It seems that:
  (add-to-list 'initial-frame-alist '(height . 37)) ;; originally 36

is also sufficient to solve the problem. I'm not sure if that's the
right way to change the frame height, and where the default actually
comes from?

Also, I don't wnat to go too far deep into what's probably an unrelated issue, but I suspect part of the trigger here is that I *always* see at startup:
  Auto-save file lists were found.  If an Emacs session crashed recently,
  type M-x recover-session RET to recover the files you were editing.

and it has always seemed like session recovery under OS X is never working quite right -- M-x recover-session shows me 5 years worth of greyed-out .saves*~ twiddle files, which rarely seem tbe recoverable. I'm not sure if something is actually wrong or if users are expected to manually delete seemingly now-irrelevnt unrecoverabke sesson save files, but consequently this message on the splash screens is a normal condition for me.

--
jhawk@alum.mit.edu
John Hawkinson

bug#23074: 25.1.50; X11: `use-fancy-splash-screens-p` erroneously returns nil.

[Eli Zaretskii]

> Date: Sat, 10 Apr 2021 11:33:54 -0400
> From: John Hawkinson <jhawk@alum.mit.edu>
> Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>, esq@lawlist.com, johnw@gnu.org,
>         23074-done@debbugs.gnu.org
> 
> > > Ping!  I'd like to fix this problem for Emacs 25.1, if possible.
> ...
> > More information was requested, but none was given within 4 years, so
> > I'm closing this bug.  If this is still an issue, please reply to this
> > email (use "Reply to all" in your email client) and we can reopen the
> > bug report.
> 
> This is still an issue, I think. I upgraded from Emacs 24.3 to 27.2 this morning, and the first thing I noticed was the missing splash screen graphic.
> 
> Notably,
> https://emacs.stackexchange.com/questions/20976/x11-why-is-the-emacs-logo-image-missing-on-the-welcome-screen
> recommends adjusting use-fancy-splash-screens-p's calculation constants, so I suspect that may be what a lot of people do.
> 
> It seems that:
>   (add-to-list 'initial-frame-alist '(height . 37)) ;; originally 36
> 
> is also sufficient to solve the problem. I'm not sure if that's the
> right way to change the frame height, and where the default actually
> comes from?

In https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=23074#38 I requested
some information necessary to understand what is going on and why.
Could you please provide that?

Also, I'm not sure I understand what systems are affected.  You didn't
provide the information collected by "M-x report-emacs-bug", so I
don't even know on what OS are you seeing this and in which Emacs
configuration.

bug#23074: 25.1.50; X11: `use-fancy-splash-screens-p` erroneously returns nil.

[John Hawkinson]

Thanks for the quick response.

Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> wrote on Sat, 10 Apr 2021
at 13:35:25 EDT in <838s5q59gi.fsf@gnu.org>:

> In https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=23074#38 I requested
> some information necessary to understand what is going on and why.
> Could you please provide that?

Sure. I honestly wasn't sure which of the 4-years-old requests were still at issue.
From /Applications/Emacs.app/Contents/MacOS/Emacs -Q:

  (let* ((img (create-image (fancy-splash-image-file)))
	 (image-height (and img (cdr (image-size img nil)))))
    (message "%s" image-height))
"16.642857142857142"


Also, I need to correct myself, it looks like I made an error when I said:

  (add-to-list 'initial-frame-alist '(height . 37)) ;; originally 36

was sufficient. It needs to be 38:

  (add-to-list 'initial-frame-alist '(height . 38)) ;; originally 36

Not sure how I jumbled that up.


> Also, I'm not sure I understand what systems are affected.  You didn't
> provide the information collected by "M-x report-emacs-bug", so I
> don't even know on what OS are you seeing this and in which Emacs
> configuration.

Sorry, the backdrop of this bug was MacOS ("Emacs master branch built `--with-x --with-ns=no` with full image support on an OSX machine (10.6.8) does not display the Emacs logo ..."), and it wasn't clear to me I should treat reopening an ancient unresolved bug as a new one, but here's the trimmed output from r-e-b:


  In GNU Emacs 27.2 (build 1, x86_64-apple-darwin15.6.0, NS appkit-1404.47 Version 10.11.6 (Build 15G22010))
   of 2021-03-27 built on builder10-11.porkrind.org
  Windowing system distributor 'Apple', version 10.3.1504
  System Description:  Mac OS X 10.12.6
  
  Configured using:
   'configure --with-ns '--enable-locallisppath=/Library/Application
   Support/Emacs/${version}/site-lisp:/Library/Application
   Support/Emacs/site-lisp' --with-modules
   CFLAGS=-DNSTextAlignmentRight=NSRightTextAlignment'
  
  Configured features:
  NOTIFY KQUEUE ACL GNUTLS LIBXML2 ZLIB TOOLKIT_SCROLL_BARS NS MODULES
  THREADS JSON PDUMPER GMP
  
  Important settings:
    value of $LANG: en_US.UTF-8
    locale-coding-system: utf-8-unix

Anything else that would be helpful?
Is it worth investigating the question of session recovery behavior?

--
jhawk@alum.mit.edu
John Hawkinson
+1 617 797 0250

bug#23074: 25.1.50; X11: `use-fancy-splash-screens-p` erroneously returns nil.

[John Hawkinson]

Hi, Eli et al, and happy new year. Is there a status on this?

I got a new M1 Max Macbook running MacOS 12.1 and this problem persists.

Is any more debugging information required?

Is there any more I could do?

Thank you.
--
jhawk@alum.mit.edu
John Hawkinson


In GNU Emacs 27.2 (build 1, arm-apple-darwin20.3.0, NS appkit-2022.30 Version 11.2.3 (Build 20D91))
 of 2021-03-27 built on armbob.porkrind.org
Windowing system distributor 'Apple', version 10.3.2113
System Description:  macOS 12.1

Configured using:
 'configure --with-ns '--enable-locallisppath=/Library/Application
 Support/Emacs/${version}/site-lisp:/Library/Application
 Support/Emacs/site-lisp' --with-modules'

Configured features:
NOTIFY KQUEUE ACL GNUTLS LIBXML2 ZLIB TOOLKIT_SCROLL_BARS NS MODULES
THREADS JSON PDUMPER GMP

Important settings:
  value of $LANG: en_US.UTF-8
  locale-coding-system: utf-8-unix

bug#23074: 25.1.50; X11: `use-fancy-splash-screens-p` erroneously returns nil.

[Eli Zaretskii]

> Date: Thu, 30 Dec 2021 17:49:00 -0500
> From: John Hawkinson <jhawk@alum.mit.edu>
> Cc: stefan@marxist.se, esq@lawlist.com, johnw@gnu.org, 23074@debbugs.gnu.org
> 
> Hi, Eli et al, and happy new year. Is there a status on this?
> 
> I got a new M1 Max Macbook running MacOS 12.1 and this problem persists.
> 
> Is any more debugging information required?
> 
> Is there any more I could do?

Would people who use macOS please chime in and tell whether this is a
general problem on macOS or something more subtle?

on my system (which isn't macOS) the splash screen displays correctly
in the pretest of Emacs 28.1, even though I do have auto-save files.

bug#23074: 25.1.50; X11: `use-fancy-splash-screens-p` erroneously returns nil.

[Keith David Bershatsky]

Other people with OSX may have different setups for X11 and image support.  I use macports for my building/operating environment:

$ sudo port installed

The following ports are currently installed:
  appres @1.0.4_0 (active)
  aspell @0.60.6.1_1 (active)
  aspell-dict-en @7.1_0 (active)
  aspell-dict-es @1.11-2_0 (active)
  at-spi2-atk @2.18.1_0 (active)
  at-spi2-core @2.18.3_0 (active)
  atk @2.18.0_0 (active)
  autoconf @2.69_5 (active)
  autoconf-archive @2016.03.20_0 (active)
  automake @1.15_1 (active)
  bdftopcf @1.0.5_0 (active)
  bison @3.0.4_1 (active)
  bison-runtime @3.0.4_0 (active)
  bitmap @1.0.8_0 (active)
  boehmgc @7.4.2_1 (active)
  boost @1.59.0_2+no_single+no_static+python27 (active)
  bzip2 @1.0.6_0 (active)
  cairo @1.14.6_0+quartz+x11 (active)
  cctools @877.5_2+llvm34 (active)
  clang-3.4 @3.4.2_9+analyzer (active)
  clang_select @1.0_0 (active)
  cmake @3.5.1_0 (active)
  coreutils @8.25_0 (active)
  ctags @5.8_2 (active)
  curl @7.48.0_0+ssl (active)
  curl-ca-bundle @7.48.0_0 (active)
  cyrus-sasl2 @2.1.26_6+kerberos (active)
  db46 @4.6.21_10 (active)
  db48 @4.8.30_4+java (active)
  dbus @1.10.6_0 (active)
  desktop-file-utils @0.22_0 (active)
  djvulibre @3.5.27_0 (active)
  docbook-xml @5.0_3 (active)
  docbook-xml-4.1.2 @5.0_1 (active)
  docbook-xml-4.2 @5.0_1 (active)
  docbook-xml-4.3 @5.0_1 (active)
  docbook-xml-4.4 @5.0_1 (active)
  docbook-xml-4.5 @5.0_1 (active)
  docbook-xml-5.0 @5.0_1 (active)
  docbook-xsl @1.79.1_0 (active)
  editres @1.0.6_0 (active)
  expat @2.1.0_0 (active)
  fftw-3 @3.3.4_1 (active)
  findutils @4.6.0_0 (active)
  flex @2.6.0_0 (active)
  font-adobe-75dpi @1.0.3_0 (active)
  font-adobe-100dpi @1.0.3_0 (active)
  font-adobe-utopia-75dpi @1.0.4_0 (active)
  font-adobe-utopia-100dpi @1.0.4_0 (active)
  font-adobe-utopia-type1 @1.0.4_0 (active)
  font-alias @1.0.3_0 (active)
  font-arabic-misc @1.0.3_0 (active)
  font-bh-75dpi @1.0.3_0 (active)
  font-bh-100dpi @1.0.3_0 (active)
  font-bh-lucidatypewriter-75dpi @1.0.3_0 (active)
  font-bh-lucidatypewriter-100dpi @1.0.3_0 (active)
  font-bh-ttf @1.0.3_0 (active)
  font-bh-type1 @1.0.3_0 (active)
  font-bitstream-75dpi @1.0.3_0 (active)
  font-bitstream-100dpi @1.0.3_0 (active)
  font-bitstream-speedo @1.0.2_0 (active)
  font-bitstream-type1 @1.0.3_0 (active)
  font-cronyx-cyrillic @1.0.3_0 (active)
  font-cursor-misc @1.0.3_0 (active)
  font-daewoo-misc @1.0.3_0 (active)
  font-dec-misc @1.0.3_0 (active)
  font-ibm-type1 @1.0.3_0 (active)
  font-isas-misc @1.0.3_0 (active)
  font-jis-misc @1.0.3_0 (active)
  font-micro-misc @1.0.3_0 (active)
  font-misc-cyrillic @1.0.3_0 (active)
  font-misc-ethiopic @1.0.3_0 (active)
  font-misc-meltho @1.0.3_0 (active)
  font-misc-misc @1.1.2_0 (active)
  font-mutt-misc @1.0.3_0 (active)
  font-schumacher-misc @1.1.2_0 (active)
  font-screen-cyrillic @1.0.4_0 (active)
  font-sony-misc @1.0.3_0 (active)
  font-sun-misc @1.0.3_0 (active)
  font-winitzki-cyrillic @1.0.3_0 (active)
  font-xfree86-type1 @1.0.4_0 (active)
  fontconfig @2.11.1_0 (active)
  fonttosfnt @1.0.4_1 (active)
  fop @1.1_0 (active)
  freetype @2.6.3_0 (active)
  fslsfonts @1.0.5_0 (active)
  fstobdf @1.0.6_0 (active)
  gawk @4.1.3_0 (active)
  gdb @7.9.1_3 (active)
  gdbm @1.11_1 (active)
  gdk-pixbuf2 @2.32.3_0+x11 (active)
  gettext @0.19.7_0 (active)
  ghostscript @9.16_1+x11 (active)
  giflib @4.2.3_0+x11 (active)
  git @2.8.0_0+credential_osxkeychain+doc+pcre+perl5_22+python27 (active)
  glib2 @2.46.2_0 (active)
  glxgears @8.3.0_0 (active)
  glxinfo @8.3.0_0 (active)
  gmp @6.1.0_1 (active)
  gnome-common @3.18.0_0 (active)
  gnupg2 @2.0.29_0 (active)
  gnutar @1.28_0 (active)
  gnutls @3.3.22_0 (active)
  gobject-introspection @1.46.0_2 (active)
  gperf @3.0.4_2 (active)
  gpg-agent @2.0.29_0+pinentry (active)
  graphite2 @1.3.7_0 (active)
  grep @2.24_0 (active)
  groff @1.22.3_0 (active)
  gsed @4.2.2_0 (active)
  gtk-doc @1.24_2 (active)
  gtk3 @3.18.9_0+x11 (active)
  gzip @1.6_0 (active)
  harfbuzz @1.2.4_0 (active)
  help2man @1.47.3_0 (active)
  hicolor-icon-theme @0.15_0 (active)
  iceauth @1.0.7_0 (active)
  ico @1.0.4_0 (active)
  icu @55.1_0 (active)
  ilmbase @1.0.2_0 (active)
  ImageMagick @6.9.3-4_0+x11 (active)
  indent @2.2.10_0 (active)
  intltool @0.51.0_1 (active)
  itstool @2.0.2_2 (active)
  jasper @1.900.1_10 (active)
  jbig2dec @0.11_2 (active)
  jbigkit @2.1_0 (active)
  jpeg @9a_1 (active)
  kerberos5 @1.14.1_0 (active)
  lcms2 @2.7_0 (active)
  ld64 @2_0+ld64_136 (active)
  ld64-136 @136_4+llvm34 (active)
  libarchive @3.1.2_2 (active)
  libassuan @2.4.2_1 (active)
  libatomic_ops @7.4.2_0 (active)
  libcomerr @1.42.13_0 (active)
  libcroco @0.6.11_0 (active)
  libedit @20150325-3.1_0 (active)
  libepoxy @1.3.1_1+python34 (active)
  libffi @3.2.1_0 (active)
  libgcrypt @1.6.5_0 (active)
  libgpg-error @1.21_0 (active)
  libiconv @1.14_0 (active)
  libidn @1.32_0 (active)
  libksba @1.3.3_0 (active)
  libmacho-headers @877.5_0 (active)
  libnetpbm @10.73.00_0 (active)
  libpaper @1.1.24_0 (active)
  libpixman @0.32.8_0 (active)
  libpng @1.6.21_0 (active)
  librsvg @2.40.13_0 (active)
  libtasn1 @4.7_0 (active)
  libtool @2.4.6_2 (active)
  libunwind-headers @3.7.0_1 (active)
  libusb @1.0.20_0 (active)
  libusb-compat @0.1.5_0 (active)
  libxml2 @2.9.2_2 (active)
  libxslt @1.1.28_1 (active)
  listres @1.0.3_0 (active)
  llvm-3.4 @3.4.2_8 (active)
  llvm_select @1.0_0 (active)
  luit @1.1.1_0 (active)
  lzo2 @2.09_0 (active)
  m4 @1.4.17_0 (active)
  mesa @11.1.2_0+osmesa+python27 (active)
  mkfontdir @1.0.7_0 (active)
  mkfontscale @1.1.2_0 (active)
  mmencode @2.7_0 (active)
  ncurses @6.0_0 (active)
  netpbm @10.73.00_0+x11 (active)
  nettle @3.1.1_0 (active)
  oclock @1.0.3_0 (active)
  openexr @1.7.0_0 (active)
  openjade @1.3.2_10 (active)
  openjpeg @2.1.0_0 (active)
  openjpeg15 @1.5.2_0 (active)
  openldap @2.4.40_2 (active)
  openmotif @2.3.4_3 (active)
  opensp @1.5.2_2 (active)
  openssl @1.0.2g_0 (active)
  p5.22-authen-sasl @2.160.0_0 (active)
  p5.22-cgi @4.280.0_0 (active)
  p5.22-digest-hmac @1.30.0_0 (active)
  p5.22-digest-sha1 @2.130.0_4 (active)
  p5.22-encode-locale @1.50.0_0 (active)
  p5.22-error @0.170.240_0 (active)
  p5.22-file-listing @6.40.0_1 (active)
  p5.22-getopt-long @2.480.0_0 (active)
  p5.22-gssapi @0.280.0_3 (active)
  p5.22-html-form @6.30.0_1 (active)
  p5.22-html-parser @3.720.0_0 (active)
  p5.22-html-tagset @3.200.0_4 (active)
  p5.22-http-cookies @6.10.0_1 (active)
  p5.22-http-daemon @6.10.0_1 (active)
  p5.22-http-date @6.20.0_1 (active)
  p5.22-http-message @6.110.0_0 (active)
  p5.22-http-negotiate @6.10.0_1 (active)
  p5.22-io @1.250.0_4 (active)
  p5.22-io-html @1.1.0_0 (active)
  p5.22-io-socket-inet6 @2.720.0_0 (active)
  p5.22-io-socket-ip @0.370.0_0 (active)
  p5.22-io-socket-ssl @2.24.0_0 (active)
  p5.22-libwww-perl @6.150.0_0+ssl (active)
  p5.22-locale-gettext @1.70.0_0 (active)
  p5.22-lwp-mediatypes @6.20.0_1 (active)
  p5.22-lwp-protocol-https @6.60.0_1 (active)
  p5.22-mime-base64 @3.150.0_0 (active)
  p5.22-mozilla-ca @20160104_0 (active)
  p5.22-net-http @6.90.0_0 (active)
  p5.22-net-libidn @0.120.0_4 (active)
  p5.22-net-smtp-ssl @1.30.0_0 (active)
  p5.22-net-ssleay @1.720.0_0 (active)
  p5.22-pathtools @3.620.0_0 (active)
  p5.22-scalar-list-utils @1.450.0_0 (active)
  p5.22-socket6 @0.270.0_0 (active)
  p5.22-sub-uplevel @0.250.0_0 (active)
  p5.22-term-readkey @2.330.0_0 (active)
  p5.22-test-deep @1.120.0_0 (active)
  p5.22-test-exception @0.430.0_0 (active)
  p5.22-test-nowarnings @1.40.0_1 (active)
  p5.22-test-simple @1.1.14_0 (active)
  p5.22-test-warn @0.300.0_1 (active)
  p5.22-uri @1.710.0_0 (active)
  p5.22-www-robotrules @6.20.0_1 (active)
  p5.22-xml-parser @2.440.0_0 (active)
  p7zip @15.09_0 (active)
  p11-kit @0.22.1_0 (active)
  pango @1.38.1_0+quartz+x11 (active)
  pcre @8.38_0 (active)
  perl5 @5.22.1_1+perl5_22 (active)
  perl5.22 @5.22.1_1 (active)
  pinentry @0.9.6_0 (active)
  pkgconfig @0.29.1_0 (active)
  poppler @0.42.0_0 (active)
  poppler-data @0.4.7_0 (active)
  popt @1.16_0 (active)
  psutils @p17_1 (active)
  pth @2.0.7_1 (active)
  py27-beaker @1.7.0_0 (active)
  py27-libxml2 @2.9.2_0 (active)
  py27-mako @1.0.4_0 (active)
  py27-markupsafe @0.23_0 (active)
  py27-setuptools @19.2_0 (active)
  python2_select @0.0_1 (active)
  python3_select @0.0_1 (active)
  python27 @2.7.11_2 (active)
  python34 @3.4.4_1 (active)
  python_select @0.3_6 (active)
  quartz-wm @1.3.2_0 (active)
  readline @6.3.003_1 (active)
  rendercheck @1.5_0 (active)
  rgb @1.0.6_0 (active)
  rsync @3.1.2_0 (active)
  sessreg @1.1.0_0 (active)
  setxkbmap @1.3.1_0 (active)
  shared-mime-info @1.6_0 (active)
  showfont @1.0.5_0 (active)
  smproxy @1.0.6_0 (active)
  source-highlight @3.1.8_0 (active)
  sqlite3 @3.11.1_1 (active)
  sshpass @1.05_0 (active)
  tcp_wrappers @20_2 (active)
  texinfo @6.1_0 (active)
  tiff @4.0.6_1 (active)
  tradcpp @0.4_0 (active)
  transset @1.0.1_0 (active)
  twm @1.0.9_0 (active)
  unrar @5.2.7_0 (active)
  unzip @6.0_0 (active)
  urw-fonts @1.0.7pre44_0 (active)
  vala @0.30.1_0 (active)
  viewres @1.0.4_0 (active)
  w3m @0.5.3_5 (active)
  webp @0.5.0_0 (active)
  wget @1.17.1_0+ssl (active)
  x11perf @1.6.0_0 (active)
  xauth @1.0.9_1 (active)
  xbacklight @1.2.1_0 (active)
  xbitmaps @1.1.1_0 (active)
  xcalc @1.0.6_0 (active)
  xclipboard @1.1.3_0 (active)
  xclock @1.0.7_0 (active)
  xcmsdb @1.0.5_0 (active)
  xcompmgr @1.1.7_0 (active)
  xconsole @1.0.6_0 (active)
  xcursorgen @1.0.6_0 (active)
  xditview @1.0.4_0 (active)
  xdm @1.1.11_0 (active)
  xdpyinfo @1.3.2_0 (active)
  xedit @1.2.2_0 (active)
  xev @1.2.2_0 (active)
  xeyes @1.1.1_0 (active)
  xfd @1.1.2_0 (active)
  xfindproxy @1.0.4_0 (active)
  xfontsel @1.0.5_0 (active)
  xfs @1.1.4_0 (active)
  xfsinfo @1.0.5_0 (active)
  Xft2 @2.3.2_0 (active)
  xgamma @1.0.6_0 (active)
  xgc @1.0.5_0 (active)
  xhost @1.0.7_0 (active)
  xinit @1.3.4_2 (active)
  xinput @1.6.2_0 (active)
  xkbcomp @1.3.1_0 (active)
  xkbevd @1.1.4_0 (active)
  xkbprint @1.0.4_0 (active)
  xkbutils @1.0.4_0 (active)
  xkeyboard-config @2.5.1_1 (active)
  xkill @1.0.4_0 (active)
  xload @1.1.2_0 (active)
  xlogo @1.0.4_0 (active)
  xlsatoms @1.1.2_0 (active)
  xlsclients @1.1.3_0 (active)
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  xmag @1.0.6_0 (active)
  xman @1.1.4_0 (active)
  xmessage @1.0.4_0 (active)
  xmh @1.0.3_0 (active)
  xmlcatmgr @2.2_1 (active)
  xmodmap @1.0.9_0 (active)
  xmore @1.0.2_0 (active)
  xorg @20090316_0 (active)
  xorg-applewmproto @1.4.2_0 (active)
  xorg-apps @20151011_0 (active)
  xorg-bigreqsproto @1.1.2_0 (active)
  xorg-compositeproto @0.4.2_0 (active)
  xorg-damageproto @1.2.1_0 (active)
  xorg-dmxproto @2.3.1_0 (active)
  xorg-dri2proto @2.8_0 (active)
  xorg-encodings @1.0.4_0 (active)
  xorg-fixesproto @5.0_0 (active)
  xorg-font-util @1.3.1_0 (active)
  xorg-fontcacheproto @0.1.3_0 (active)
  xorg-fonts @20090102_1 (active)
  xorg-fontsproto @2.1.3_0 (active)
  xorg-glproto @1.4.17_0 (active)
  xorg-inputproto @2.3.1_0 (active)
  xorg-kbproto @1.0.7_0 (active)
  xorg-libAppleWM @1.4.1_0 (active)
  xorg-libdmx @1.1.3_0 (active)
  xorg-libfontenc @1.1.3_0 (active)
  xorg-libFS @1.0.7_0 (active)
  xorg-libice @1.0.9_0 (active)
  xorg-libpthread-stubs @0.3_0 (active)
  xorg-libsm @1.2.1_0 (active)
  xorg-libX11 @1.6.3_0 (active)
  xorg-libXau @1.0.8_0 (active)
  xorg-libXaw @1.0.13_2 (active)
  xorg-libxcb @1.11.1_0+python27 (active)
  xorg-libXcomposite @0.4.4_0 (active)
  xorg-libXcursor @1.1.14_0 (active)
  xorg-libXdamage @1.1.4_0 (active)
  xorg-libXdmcp @1.1.2_0 (active)
  xorg-libXext @1.3.3_0 (active)
  xorg-libXfixes @5.0.1_0 (active)
  xorg-libXfont @1.5.1_1 (active)
  xorg-libXfontcache @1.0.5_0 (active)
  xorg-libXi @1.7.6_0 (active)
  xorg-libXinerama @1.1.3_0 (active)
  xorg-libxkbfile @1.0.9_0 (active)
  xorg-libXmu @1.1.2_0 (active)
  xorg-libXp @1.0.3_0 (active)
  xorg-libXrandr @1.5.0_0 (active)
  xorg-libXt @1.1.5_1+flat_namespace (active)
  xorg-libXTrap @1.0.1_0 (active)
  xorg-libXtst @1.2.2_0 (active)
  xorg-libXv @1.0.10_0 (active)
  xorg-libXxf86misc @1.0.3_0 (active)
  xorg-libXxf86vm @1.1.4_0 (active)
  xorg-presentproto @1.0_0 (active)
  xorg-printproto @1.0.5_0 (active)
  xorg-randrproto @1.5.0_0 (active)
  xorg-recordproto @1.14.2_0 (active)
  xorg-renderproto @0.11.1_0 (active)
  xorg-resourceproto @1.2.0_0 (active)
  xorg-scripts @1.0.1_0 (active)
  xorg-scrnsaverproto @1.2.2_0 (active)
  xorg-server @1.17.4_1 (active)
  xorg-trapproto @3.4.3_0 (active)
  xorg-util-macros @1.19.0_0 (active)
  xorg-videoproto @2.3.2_0 (active)
  xorg-xcb-proto @1.11_1+python27 (active)
  xorg-xcb-util @0.4.0_0 (active)
  xorg-xcmiscproto @1.2.2_0 (active)
  xorg-xextproto @7.3.0_0 (active)
  xorg-xf86bigfontproto @1.2.0_0 (active)
  xorg-xf86miscproto @0.9.3_0 (active)
  xorg-xf86vidmodeproto @2.3.1_0 (active)
  xorg-xineramaproto @1.2.1_0 (active)
  xorg-xproto @7.0.28_0 (active)
  xorg-xproxymanagementprotocol @1.0.3_0 (active)
  xorg-xtrans @1.3.5_0 (active)
  xpdf @3.04_0 (active)
  xpm @3.5.11_0 (active)
  xpr @1.0.4_0 (active)
  xprop @1.2.2_0 (active)
  xrandr @1.4.3_0 (active)
  xrdb @1.1.0_0 (active)
  xrefresh @1.0.5_0 (active)
  xrender @0.9.9_0 (active)
  xset @1.2.3_0 (active)
  xsetmode @1.0.0_1 (active)
  xsetpointer @1.0.1_1 (active)
  xsetroot @1.1.1_0 (active)
  xsm @1.0.3_0 (active)
  xstdcmap @1.0.3_0 (active)
  xterm @322_0 (active)
  xtrap @1.0.2_2 (active)
  xvinfo @1.1.3_0 (active)
  xwd @1.0.6_0 (active)
  xwininfo @1.1.3_0 (active)
  xwud @1.0.4_0 (active)
  xz @5.2.2_0 (active)
  zlib @1.2.8_0 (active)

;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;

At Sat, 09 Apr 2016 10:53:02 +0300,
Eli Zaretskii wrote:
> 
> * * *
> 
> However, I wonder whether this is what all OS X users see, or just
> something specific to your system. . . .