From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#57434: 28.1.91; Terminal Emacs Mac OS flickering. Date: Thu, 01 Sep 2022 09:11:58 +0300 Message-ID: <838rn3sjwx.fsf@gnu.org> References: <83ler7vx3o.fsf@gnu.org> <838rn6x4h2.fsf@gnu.org> <834jxux3kd.fsf@gnu.org> <831qsyx2lr.fsf@gnu.org> <142be6aa-f25f-fad2-5597-6e02b0e3e4f6@gmail.com> <8335dcu0sg.fsf@gnu.org> <83mtbks7mo.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="31100"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: kuragin@google.com, 57434@debbugs.gnu.org To: Gerd =?UTF-8?Q?M=C3=B6llmann?= Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Thu Sep 01 08:12:44 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1oTdRT-0007ys-Qa for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 01 Sep 2022 08:12:44 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:36220 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oTdRS-0003ry-Qu for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 01 Sep 2022 02:12:42 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:55422) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oTdQo-0003n6-Nq for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 01 Sep 2022 02:12:02 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.43]:51204) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oTdQo-00062c-FD for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 01 Sep 2022 02:12:02 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oTdQo-0003s3-B6 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 01 Sep 2022 02:12:02 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Eli Zaretskii Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Thu, 01 Sep 2022 06:12:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 57434 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: moreinfo Original-Received: via spool by 57434-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B57434.166201270014843 (code B ref 57434); Thu, 01 Sep 2022 06:12:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 57434) by debbugs.gnu.org; 1 Sep 2022 06:11:40 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:40953 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oTdQS-0003rL-1x for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 01 Sep 2022 02:11:40 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:58672) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oTdQQ-0003r6-0Q for 57434@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 01 Sep 2022 02:11:39 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:36408) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oTdQK-00061V-OQ; Thu, 01 Sep 2022 02:11:32 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=GUjugYjvXieT57jC/NsIiG91L9cJKcn7GhUpDbQN3Us=; b=pxkQPB+FYbsRunpe40Ab /VzQiN7vOWlgwRiRgJX3gOM3/qReCDwOkoEBBaw8qGyCOb4a7n/qnhe+PVWR2Liy2ZlrlgpnMJ5jy jXaC5cMELiJbXUruqYGqqb8WnfchzLkjsmCmvF5Wm5+Ax8t+ETgWl+Lsm7LGmAaJQq/8VfwGyGQ01 0p1kYoTWqIX6NgH+nVltv4jVQLVxa5ACae20SxLdUMQ5qozVMIXS6tp4FXsF6ZUsWZBANftOwOh25 OlqoMZct1ltnjIiqZjcdO17xxLXjPq5KJs1YA4u78BC1+APhpYtEbFjk2Qj7fsdKU/3zF4qoqNAOd f1L614tFDIkHDQ==; Original-Received: from [87.69.77.57] (port=4373 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oTdQJ-000874-Ud; Thu, 01 Sep 2022 02:11:32 -0400 In-Reply-To: (message from Gerd =?UTF-8?Q?M=C3=B6llmann?= on Thu, 01 Sep 2022 07:44:52 +0200) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "bug-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:241230 Archived-At: > From: Gerd Möllmann > Cc: Dmitrii Kuragin , 57434@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Thu, 01 Sep 2022 07:44:52 +0200 > > Eli Zaretskii writes: > > > Given our inability to pinpoint the root cause of the problem, and the > > unsolved mystery why on some macOS systems the problem is much more > > prominent than on other macOS systems, I tend to introduce a variable > > that users could set from Lisp to tell Emacs not to use the optimized > > insert/delete-lines algorithm in scroll.c. Unless some significant > > new ideas or facts emerge in the next day or two, that is. > > I guess I've found these facts today, while rummaging in alacritty's > Github project. Thanks. So we have 2 alternatives: . declare that flickering on alacritty is currently a known problem, and wait till Someone comes up with the proper solution for Emacs; . add that variable I mentioned above, and let users try to fix the problem with alacritty by flipping it. TBH, given your description, I'm no longer sure a simple boolean variable that disables insert/delete-line optimization will do, since the issue seems to be a much more general one. How sure are we that some other scenario of redrawing a TTY frame won't cause similar flickering regardless of the insert/delete-line feature? So maybe just document the issue in PROBLEMS and advise against using alacritty?