From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#22038: 25.1.50; Character folding issues with isearch Date: Sat, 28 Nov 2015 20:51:50 +0200 Message-ID: <837fl2ot2x.fsf@gnu.org> References: <87fuzqkszp.fsf@gmx.net> <83egfaoz7b.fsf@gnu.org> <877fl2kq1u.fsf@gmx.net> <83bnaeowdx.fsf@gnu.org> <8737vqkmk3.fsf@gmx.net> Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1448736802 12549 80.91.229.3 (28 Nov 2015 18:53:22 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 28 Nov 2015 18:53:22 +0000 (UTC) Cc: 22038@debbugs.gnu.org To: Stephen Berman Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Nov 28 19:53:09 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1a2kcM-0004XA-6X for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sat, 28 Nov 2015 19:53:06 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:33422 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1a2kcP-0006jj-M9 for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sat, 28 Nov 2015 13:53:09 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:40136) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1a2kcL-0006je-Un for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 28 Nov 2015 13:53:06 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1a2kcH-0000RT-Uo for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 28 Nov 2015 13:53:05 -0500 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.43]:40448) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1a2kcH-0000RP-RW for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 28 Nov 2015 13:53:01 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1a2kcH-0005Ql-Nc for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 28 Nov 2015 13:53:01 -0500 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Eli Zaretskii Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sat, 28 Nov 2015 18:53:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 22038 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by 22038-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B22038.144873672320808 (code B ref 22038); Sat, 28 Nov 2015 18:53:01 +0000 Original-Received: (at 22038) by debbugs.gnu.org; 28 Nov 2015 18:52:03 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:58389 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1a2kbK-0005PV-WC for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 28 Nov 2015 13:52:03 -0500 Original-Received: from mtaout20.012.net.il ([80.179.55.166]:57467) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1a2kbJ-0005P7-FV for 22038@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 28 Nov 2015 13:52:02 -0500 Original-Received: from conversion-daemon.a-mtaout20.012.net.il by a-mtaout20.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) id <0NYJ00300GCIK700@a-mtaout20.012.net.il> for 22038@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 28 Nov 2015 20:52:00 +0200 (IST) Original-Received: from HOME-C4E4A596F7 ([84.94.185.246]) by a-mtaout20.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) with ESMTPA id <0NYJ0033YGEOEH60@a-mtaout20.012.net.il>; Sat, 28 Nov 2015 20:52:00 +0200 (IST) In-reply-to: <8737vqkmk3.fsf@gmx.net> X-012-Sender: halo1@inter.net.il X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 3.x X-Received-From: 208.118.235.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:109383 Archived-At: > From: Stephen Berman > Cc: 22038@debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Sat, 28 Nov 2015 19:26:20 +0100 > > > Easiness is not the most important issue here: there's a more basic > > problem involved. Both "ß" vs "ss" and "æ" vs "a" (or "ae") are > > language-specific: they are only valid matches in the context of > > specific languages. AFAIU, that is why they are not in the Unicode > > database. And we don't yet have language-specific text processing > > capabilities and infrastructure (well, string-collate-lessp and > > string-collate-equalp are a beginning, but only that). So allowing > > those by default risk running afoul of what users want. > > I'm not sure what you mean by "only valid matches in the context of > specific languages", but it sounds like what Per Starbäck said about "ä" > being considered a completely separate character from "a" in Swedish, > unlike in German. Yet if this is a language-specific difference, Emacs > doesn't respect it by default, since "a" does match "ä" under > character-folding. (Or does it fail to do so when > current-language-environment is Swedish? I suspect it doesn't.) We simply go by the decompositions that the (language-agnostic) Unicode database specified, and do not augment that by anything that is only valid or relevant in the context of specific languages. > But I know nothing about the Unicode specifications; maybe you are > referring to a more subtle issue, which may be unrelated to my point, > which is simply that I think it should be just as convenient for a user > whose keyboard may lack "ß" or "æ" to match these characters by > searching with "s" or "a" (or "e" or "ae") as it is to match "ff" by > searching with "f". This is not a language-specific issue AFAICS. The character folding feature is primarily a feature of search, not a convenience feature for typing characters, although it might double as that.