From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Drew Adams" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#13731: 24.3.50; C-h N -- Outline navigation Fails Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2013 11:23:20 -0800 Message-ID: <6C20A984A05D40E0A69AB390817CD69A@us.oracle.com> References: <87liaocc00.fsf@gmail.com> <20767.58974.404379.553141@gargle.gargle.HOWL><83obfkqagr.fsf@gnu.org><20768.17500.927206.155870@gargle.gargle.HOWL><83lianr449.fsf@gnu.org> <87y5ek1diw.fsf@bzg.ath.cx> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1361301853 30158 80.91.229.3 (19 Feb 2013 19:24:13 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2013 19:24:13 +0000 (UTC) Cc: 13731@debbugs.gnu.org To: "'Bastien'" , "'T.V. Raman'" Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Feb 19 20:24:35 2013 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1U7snp-00052M-22 for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Tue, 19 Feb 2013 20:24:33 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:46925 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1U7snU-00033a-NQ for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Tue, 19 Feb 2013 14:24:12 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:58310) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1U7snN-00032I-Az for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 19 Feb 2013 14:24:10 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1U7snG-0003L1-TA for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 19 Feb 2013 14:24:05 -0500 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.43]:60146) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1U7snG-0003Kv-PN for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 19 Feb 2013 14:23:58 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1U7soI-0003xP-21 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 19 Feb 2013 14:25:04 -0500 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: "Drew Adams" Original-Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2013 19:25:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 13731 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: moreinfo unreproducible Original-Received: via spool by 13731-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B13731.136130188015173 (code B ref 13731); Tue, 19 Feb 2013 19:25:01 +0000 Original-Received: (at 13731) by debbugs.gnu.org; 19 Feb 2013 19:24:40 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:37377 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1U7snt-0003we-H6 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 19 Feb 2013 14:24:39 -0500 Original-Received: from aserp1040.oracle.com ([141.146.126.69]:20490) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1U7snq-0003wV-E4 for 13731@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 19 Feb 2013 14:24:35 -0500 Original-Received: from acsinet22.oracle.com (acsinet22.oracle.com [141.146.126.238]) by aserp1040.oracle.com (Sentrion-MTA-4.3.1/Sentrion-MTA-4.3.1) with ESMTP id r1JJNPSm011945 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 19 Feb 2013 19:23:25 GMT Original-Received: from acsmt356.oracle.com (acsmt356.oracle.com [141.146.40.156]) by acsinet22.oracle.com (8.14.4+Sun/8.14.4) with ESMTP id r1JJNODQ017525 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Tue, 19 Feb 2013 19:23:25 GMT Original-Received: from abhmt115.oracle.com (abhmt115.oracle.com [141.146.116.67]) by acsmt356.oracle.com (8.12.11.20060308/8.12.11) with ESMTP id r1JJNOpU008561; Tue, 19 Feb 2013 13:23:24 -0600 Original-Received: from dradamslap1 (/10.159.138.144) by default (Oracle Beehive Gateway v4.0) with ESMTP ; Tue, 19 Feb 2013 11:23:24 -0800 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 In-Reply-To: <87y5ek1diw.fsf@bzg.ath.cx> Thread-Index: Ac4O0W4xeCmOrAcKQyid/lH6KswrLgAAsi/g X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.6157 X-Source-IP: acsinet22.oracle.com [141.146.126.238] X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6.x X-Received-From: 140.186.70.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:71528 Archived-At: > > outline-regexp is customizable, and its default value had gotten > > changed in my customization settings at some point. Would be > > wise for C-h N to set outline-regexp appropriately -- perhaps > > via a file-local variable in the News file? > > The docstring of `outline-regexp' says > The recommended way to set this is with a Local Variables: list in > the file it applies to. > So I'd suggest to simply follow the recommendation here. I'd say that that is a doc bug. This is a _user option_. The recommended way to set (i.e., customize) it should be to use Customize. Users do not necessarily even have a particular file within which using Local Variables would make sense for this. I suggest we remove that recommendation from the doc string. Or we change the status of this variable from a defcustom to a defvar. If you want to say that you recommend that Lisp code that sets the value use Local Variables, that would presumably be OK as far as it goes. But the general idea is that Lisp code should not trample on user option values. And note that nothing else in file outline.el mentions the fact that `outline-regexp' is likely to be buffer-local. It seems that that statement has been in the doc string from the beginning - at least as far back as Emacs 20. I still think it is misguided. The same recommendation appears in (emacs) `Outline Format': You can customize the criterion for distinguishing heading lines by setting the variable `outline-regexp'. (The recommended ways to do this are in a major mode function or with a file local variable.) Any line whose beginning has a match for this regexp is considered a heading line. Matches that start within a line (not at the left margin) do not count. That hardly sounds like the kind of user customization of a defcustom that Emacs recommends in general. Sounds like something to be recommended for a defvar value instead. Just one opinion.