From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Drew Adams Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#6578: 24.0.50; defcustom :set does not apply to `set-variable' Date: Wed, 21 Aug 2019 16:39:12 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <52f8fea3-f1b9-44ae-9df2-4ecb70445f39@default> References: <7AE1FD06C5674B68B58CAFD6896A6C4C@us.oracle.com> <87r25euo5q.fsf@mouse.gnus.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: blaine.gmane.org; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:195.159.176.226"; logging-data="29752"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@blaine.gmane.org" Cc: 6578@debbugs.gnu.org To: Lars Ingebrigtsen Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Aug 22 01:40:16 2019 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1i0aD6-0007d3-O4 for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; 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Wed, 21 Aug 2019 23:39:19 GMT Original-Received: from aserv0122.oracle.com (aserv0122.oracle.com [141.146.126.236]) by userp3020.oracle.com with ESMTP id 2uh83p97au-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 21 Aug 2019 23:39:19 +0000 Original-Received: from abhmp0007.oracle.com (abhmp0007.oracle.com [141.146.116.13]) by aserv0122.oracle.com (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id x7LNdEYx001602; Wed, 21 Aug 2019 23:39:18 GMT In-Reply-To: <87r25euo5q.fsf@mouse.gnus.org> X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Oracle Beehive Extensions for Outlook 2.0.1.9.1 (1003210) [OL 16.0.4873.0 (x86)] X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=nai engine=6000 definitions=9355 signatures=668684 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 suspectscore=0 malwarescore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 mlxscore=0 mlxlogscore=999 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.0.1-1906280000 definitions=main-1908210232 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=nai engine=6000 definitions=9355 signatures=668684 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 priorityscore=1501 malwarescore=0 suspectscore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 clxscore=1011 lowpriorityscore=0 mlxscore=0 impostorscore=0 mlxlogscore=999 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.0.1-1906280000 definitions=main-1908210232 X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 209.51.188.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "bug-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:165540 Archived-At: > > If you use a :set entry for defcustom, it is not > > respected by `set-variable'. It should be. When > > a user uses `M-x set-variable' s?he should get the > > effect of :set. Otherwise, the defcustom is not > > serving its purpose. defcustom is not only for > > Customize - it needs to work with `set-variable' > > also. And it does, for :type; but it does not, > > for :set. >=20 > This is apparently by design: >=20 > ---- > Note that this function is at heart equivalent to the basic =E2=80=98set= =E2=80=99 > function. > For a variable defined with =E2=80=98defcustom=E2=80=99, it does not pay = attention to > any :set property that the variable might have (if you want that, use > M-x customize-set-variable instead). > ---- I know (and knew) that the behavior is documented. That doesn't mean it's good. This is an enhancement request: it "_should_" provide the effect of :set. Anything else is just a gotcha, inviting problems. We document the weak behavior, because it is what it is. We should document it, whatever it is. That doesn't make it good. What's more, `customize-set-variable' isn't even documented in the Emacs or Elisp manuals. `set-variable' is (in the Emacs manual), and it even has an index entry. What's more, (emacs) `Examining' says that "The most convenient way to set a specific customizable variable is with `set-variable'. That's an endorsement/recommendation, and it can get users into trouble. That doc should perhaps use `customize-set-variable' instead. More generally, perhaps some harmonizing of behavior/features is in order, among `set-variable', `customize-set-variable', and `customize-set-value'. Users can be excused for being confused, and they can get into trouble when they set an option value using just `set-variable' or `setq', if it has a :set function. Emacs should be enhanced to clear up the confusing differences and clear up the doc recommendations. > So I'm closing this bug report. Unfortunate. Someone might have implemented the enhancement someday.