From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Drew Adams Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#13841: 24.3.50; Regression - unreadable `C-h k' help Date: Sat, 30 Apr 2016 07:37:50 -0800 (GMT-08:00) Message-ID: <4e02c2a0-6e68-4091-a64d-131bcfc2fc49@default> References: <98E304F5436E487A91B33E89A04A5851@us.oracle.com> <87sirr1l0d.fsf@building.gnus.org> <87h9el2wcj.fsf@gnus.org> <87inyze2tq.fsf@web.de> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1462030783 25121 80.91.229.3 (30 Apr 2016 15:39:43 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 30 Apr 2016 15:39:43 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Lars Ingebrigtsen , 13841@debbugs.gnu.org To: Michael Heerdegen Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Apr 30 17:39:29 2016 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1awWzR-0005W4-K3 for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sat, 30 Apr 2016 17:39:29 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:58808 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1awWzN-0007Al-IY for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sat, 30 Apr 2016 11:39:25 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:60477) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1awWzE-0006xa-QS for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 30 Apr 2016 11:39:23 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1awWz3-0000RJ-72 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 30 Apr 2016 11:39:11 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.43]:45624) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1awWz3-0000Q7-3z for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 30 Apr 2016 11:39:05 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1awWyz-0005bR-PT for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 30 Apr 2016 11:39:01 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Drew Adams Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sat, 30 Apr 2016 15:39:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 13841 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by 13841-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B13841.146203068221471 (code B ref 13841); Sat, 30 Apr 2016 15:39:01 +0000 Original-Received: (at 13841) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Apr 2016 15:38:02 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:57961 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1awWy1-0005a7-Qb for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 30 Apr 2016 11:38:02 -0400 Original-Received: from userp1040.oracle.com ([156.151.31.81]:51047) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1awWy0-0005Zk-Oj for 13841@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 30 Apr 2016 11:38:01 -0400 Original-Received: from userv0022.oracle.com (userv0022.oracle.com [156.151.31.74]) by userp1040.oracle.com (Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2/Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2) with ESMTP id u3UFbqRj004815 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 30 Apr 2016 15:37:53 GMT Original-Received: from userv0121.oracle.com (userv0121.oracle.com [156.151.31.72]) by userv0022.oracle.com (8.14.4/8.13.8) with ESMTP id u3UFbqPQ007248 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 30 Apr 2016 15:37:52 GMT Original-Received: from abhmp0019.oracle.com (abhmp0019.oracle.com [141.146.116.25]) by userv0121.oracle.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id u3UFbpiI006397; Sat, 30 Apr 2016 15:37:52 GMT In-Reply-To: <87inyze2tq.fsf@web.de> X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Oracle Beehive Extensions for Outlook 2.0.1.9 (901082) [OL 12.0.6744.5000 (x86)] X-Source-IP: userv0022.oracle.com [156.151.31.74] X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 208.118.235.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "bug-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:117350 Archived-At: > > This is a REGRESSION. With Emacs 23.4, emacs -Q C-h k, same > > recipe, you see this: >=20 > The difference to newer Emacsen is that this menu command had been a > quoted lambda in Emacs 23 (that didn't get compiled), and has been > unquoted since then (good!). So I guess it's not a regression since > 23.4. Not sure what you're saying about when or whether a regression was introduced. In fact, this is a regression that was introduced in Emacs 24.3 (probably you meant that, not 23.4). In 24.2 and prior there was no such problem. Sure, it is a good thing in general that code gets byte-compiled. That doesn't mean that everything is better, and this is one downside to simply replacing (in effect) source code with byte code. A big advantage of Emacs and its use of Lisp is seeing into and manipulating, at runtime, the programs that underlie the behavior. Simply replacing (in effect) source code with byte code works against that introspection (whether by people or by program). If byte-compiling is going to be done in such an automatic, blanket way, then perhaps a pointer needs to be kept to the source code, for uses such as this. In this particular case, at least, showing users byte code is not helpful. I hope we can all agree on that, at least. And in this particular case, at least, a simple fix should be to use a named function and not an anonymous one (in `menu-bar-line-wrapping-menu'). But a more general solution should be sought to the various problems introduced by the aggressive/eager byte-compiling that is the underlying cause of this regression.