From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: martin rudalics Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#7445: 23.2; weird customization behavior Date: Sat, 20 Nov 2010 10:18:21 +0100 Message-ID: <4CE7925D.8010204@gmx.at> References: NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1290246287 26228 80.91.229.12 (20 Nov 2010 09:44:47 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 20 Nov 2010 09:44:47 +0000 (UTC) Cc: 7445@debbugs.gnu.org To: David Abrahams Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Nov 20 10:44:40 2010 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PJjzp-0003h7-Ov for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sat, 20 Nov 2010 10:44:38 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:39833 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1PJjzp-0004Pk-4b for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sat, 20 Nov 2010 04:44:37 -0500 Original-Received: from [140.186.70.92] (port=37499 helo=eggs.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1PJjzg-0004PJ-5V for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 20 Nov 2010 04:44:30 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1PJjzd-0001Rn-NN for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 20 Nov 2010 04:44:28 -0500 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.43]:58881) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1PJjzd-0001Rh-LM for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 20 Nov 2010 04:44:25 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PJjWE-00082n-Hd; Sat, 20 Nov 2010 04:14:02 -0500 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: martin rudalics Original-Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-To: owner@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sat, 20 Nov 2010 09:14:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 7445 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by 7445-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B7445.129024439930915 (code B ref 7445); Sat, 20 Nov 2010 09:14:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 7445) by debbugs.gnu.org; 20 Nov 2010 09:13:19 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PJjVW-00082a-Mw for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 20 Nov 2010 04:13:18 -0500 Original-Received: from mailout-de.gmx.net ([213.165.64.23] helo=mail.gmx.net) by debbugs.gnu.org with smtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PJjVU-00082V-Ih for 7445@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 20 Nov 2010 04:13:18 -0500 Original-Received: (qmail invoked by alias); 20 Nov 2010 09:18:24 -0000 Original-Received: from 62-47-53-36.adsl.highway.telekom.at (EHLO [62.47.53.36]) [62.47.53.36] by mail.gmx.net (mp011) with SMTP; 20 Nov 2010 10:18:24 +0100 X-Authenticated: #14592706 X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX18dkyY3vyUdj9gZ5ZUpiGHE+6hpa+Ah7/429yHUl9 ujWGk4kK4aorJm User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.21 (Windows/20090302) In-Reply-To: X-Y-GMX-Trusted: 0 X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list Resent-Date: Sat, 20 Nov 2010 04:14:02 -0500 X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 3) X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:41761 Archived-At: > If I do `M-x customize-group tramp' (even after starting with -Q), I see: > > tramp-default-method-alist: Hide Value '(("\\`localhost\\'" "\\`root\\'" "su")) > State: CHANGED outside Customize; operating on it here may be unreliable. (mismatch) > > Several things are wrong here: > > * I see the regular variable name instead of capitalized words space > separated > > * The structure of the variable doesn't seem to be known to customize > -- I don't get a nice editor These are normal. When something goes wrong, options show up this way because the customization interface doesn't see a nice way to format and edit them reliably. > * It *wasn't* changed, at least not by me, outside of Customize > > I managed, once, in an emacs started without -Q, to get > > `M-x customize-variable tramp-default-method-alist' > > To show me the structure of the variable, but I can't reproduce this. > It still tells me falsely that it is "CHANGED outside Customize; > operating on it here may be unreliable." Call `customize-rogue' for a list of options where customizing fails the same way with emacs -Q. It's a nasty habit of programmers to ignore the customization interface. martin