From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Drew Adams" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#12487: 24.2.50; Inconsistent, so confusing, confirmation msgs for `find-alternate-file' Date: Sat, 22 Sep 2012 19:52:52 -0700 Message-ID: <1F73EE48F0C34925A43A2D1E5EE198EB@us.oracle.com> References: <87zk4hr8pr.fsf@mail.jurta.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1348368805 1299 80.91.229.3 (23 Sep 2012 02:53:25 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 23 Sep 2012 02:53:25 +0000 (UTC) Cc: 12487@debbugs.gnu.org To: "'Juri Linkov'" Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sun Sep 23 04:53:29 2012 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1TFcJy-0006fL-A2 for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sun, 23 Sep 2012 04:53:26 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:32927 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1TFcJt-0003H0-P4 for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sat, 22 Sep 2012 22:53:21 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:36638) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1TFcJr-0003Gv-A1 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 22 Sep 2012 22:53:20 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1TFcJq-0001Ja-3H for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 22 Sep 2012 22:53:19 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.43]:40443) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1TFcJq-0001JV-04 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 22 Sep 2012 22:53:18 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1TFcLW-000769-OB for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 22 Sep 2012 22:55:03 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: "Drew Adams" Original-Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sun, 23 Sep 2012 02:55:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 12487 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by 12487-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B12487.134836889827275 (code B ref 12487); Sun, 23 Sep 2012 02:55:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 12487) by debbugs.gnu.org; 23 Sep 2012 02:54:58 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49989 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1TFcLQ-00075o-PP for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 22 Sep 2012 22:54:58 -0400 Original-Received: from acsinet15.oracle.com ([141.146.126.227]:49868) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1TFcLL-00075e-Nn for 12487@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 22 Sep 2012 22:54:53 -0400 Original-Received: from ucsinet21.oracle.com (ucsinet21.oracle.com [156.151.31.93]) by acsinet15.oracle.com (Sentrion-MTA-4.2.2/Sentrion-MTA-4.2.2) with ESMTP id q8N2r3BY008388 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 23 Sep 2012 02:53:04 GMT Original-Received: from acsmt357.oracle.com (acsmt357.oracle.com [141.146.40.157]) by ucsinet21.oracle.com (8.14.4+Sun/8.14.4) with ESMTP id q8N2r18J014282 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Sun, 23 Sep 2012 02:53:01 GMT Original-Received: from abhmt109.oracle.com (abhmt109.oracle.com [141.146.116.61]) by acsmt357.oracle.com (8.12.11.20060308/8.12.11) with ESMTP id q8N2r0jQ013152; Sat, 22 Sep 2012 21:53:00 -0500 Original-Received: from dradamslap1 (/10.159.221.98) by default (Oracle Beehive Gateway v4.0) with ESMTP ; Sat, 22 Sep 2012 19:53:00 -0700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 In-Reply-To: <87zk4hr8pr.fsf@mail.jurta.org> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.6157 Thread-Index: Ac2ZFy17pfqYVWaEQAihcQGx9mnV6gAHVZ+Q X-Source-IP: ucsinet21.oracle.com [156.151.31.93] X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) X-Received-From: 140.186.70.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:64797 Archived-At: > > You are asked "Buffer foo is modified; save it first (yes or no)". > > (There is no question mark here, BTW.) You reply "no". > > Then you are asked "Kill and replace the buffer without saving it? > > (yes or no)". > > See also http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel/151762 I really hope this gets fixed. It was much better before (but there was room for improvement). Now I'm afraid that users will *lose data*. It is just too easy to answer "yes" to the first question, thinking that it is asking you to confirm the action that you, after all, asked for (which includes abandoning any changes to the currently visited file). `find-alternate-file' is not simply choosing to visit another buffer or file. It is specifically an abandonment of the current state of the currently visited file. Especially for the common use case of using it to revert to the saved state of the same file (and unmodified in any other way, including display - overlays etc.). At least for that case, the new interaction is a disaster. Imagine asking someone whether s?he wants to *save* the current file when s?he invokes `revert-buffer'! Naturally, we ask exactly the opposite: are you sure you want to abandon your changes? We should ask a question (one, not two!) here, but the question should be phrased in terms of confirming ("yes") that you want to abandon any modifications. It should not be phrased negatively, asking whether you want to do something different from what the command intends, i.e., save your changes. This change made to the user interaction no doubt reflects good intentions, but it was misguided, IMHO.