From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Gregory Heytings Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#1305: All code that currently beeps should use visual bell instead Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2021 20:59:52 +0000 Message-ID: <1869622e1602a39e56a6@heytings.org> References: <009901c9421f$5bd0a6b0$0200a8c0@us.oracle.com> <00ad01c942a0$1f49ca60$0200a8c0@us.oracle.com> <87eef9qg81.fsf@gnus.org> <1869622e162377be79e9@heytings.org> <83bladw0dh.fsf@gnu.org> <87a6pxqdeg.fsf@gnus.org> <875z0lqcj4.fsf@gnus.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="39478"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: jasonspiro4@gmail.com, 1305@debbugs.gnu.org, Stefan Kangas , monnier@iro.umontreal.ca To: Lars Ingebrigtsen Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat Apr 17 23:00:13 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1lXs32-000A4d-9N for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 17 Apr 2021 23:00:12 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:44596 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lXs30-0005GB-RQ for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 17 Apr 2021 17:00:10 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:49988) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lXs2s-0005G3-Oq for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 17 Apr 2021 17:00:02 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.43]:33232) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lXs2s-0003mA-GE for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 17 Apr 2021 17:00:02 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lXs2s-00057w-DP for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 17 Apr 2021 17:00:02 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Gregory Heytings Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2021 21:00:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 1305 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs Original-Received: via spool by 1305-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B1305.161869319519659 (code B ref 1305); Sat, 17 Apr 2021 21:00:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 1305) by debbugs.gnu.org; 17 Apr 2021 20:59:55 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:44778 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lXs2l-000571-Bx for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 17 Apr 2021 16:59:55 -0400 Original-Received: from heytings.org ([95.142.160.155]:42216) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1lXs2k-00056t-0L for 1305@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 17 Apr 2021 16:59:54 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=heytings.org; s=20210101; t=1618693192; bh=tUZG58BQRxzFFP4Oln+Ze3WPXvL5tqXmjd5VTPBnbiU=; h=Date:From:To:cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:Message-ID:References:From; b=JRjev93ZffcbmI1mCnCDTPajgliZiykgeOC8JsuzdKJmpmEMx9IQ7ZGztNlFsL9BI FhvohFRJc1/NYq8+FmtbxLUVkyfUvSfS/1UiP07LVAd6rHc2eJ9BGBaVLi3gMWgmy4 qAiPRikKNbBBufnWbxS4zYmcSIBLBcdqonZa6XpvIB+0pN7C7S1CPhxENu8nHosU+k NeWTg4L7Q+fNeuL9VWnub7m51hfGghb69vCn5du4YKn/35oY7NiwdgFnbm1zLH14iw eJQNg2dLufJ/7zWUqHHxoDF42YBhE2/q0xczsT+VbfhSoXu/DHzgXcHb4Zj/Ofdd0U tyWlyVyfCw7TQ== In-Reply-To: <875z0lqcj4.fsf@gnus.org> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "bug-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:204267 Archived-At: >>> So in this instance, defaulting `visible-bell' to "on" would make >>> `C-g' more intrusive/obnoxious than previously... which is the >>> opposite effect than what was originally discussed in this bug report. >> >> Can anything be done about that, though? > > I think this might point toward not doing anything about the default -- > people who don't like beeps will switch them off on the OS level. That > is, flipping the default will make `C-g' more intrusive for people > who've already made a decision to ignore beeps. > Note that for GNU/Linux users who use a more exotic window manager instead of Gnome or KDE, it's the opposite: they have to make an active decision to hear beeps. IOW, they will not hear any beep unless they configure their computer to do so. I checked on macOS, and the only apps (at least, the only apps among the ones I use) that repeatedly beep are the terminal and Emacs. Other apps only beep when you do something "wrong", that is, when they cannot do what you want (for example when you ask the program to paste something when there is nothing to paste), or when they open an important dialog. The terminal also beeps when it cannot do what you want (for example when you press TAB and it cannot complete the current input). In comparison, Emacs beeps a lot.