From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Ilya N. Golubev" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.xemacs.beta,gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: checking for fields Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 21:15:29 +0400 Message-ID: <13lkpeawcu.fsf@mo.msk.ru> NNTP-Posting-Host: main.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1156440801 16825 80.91.229.2 (24 Aug 2006 17:33:21 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 17:33:21 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Michael Kifer , Jerry James Original-X-From: xemacs-beta-bounces@xemacs.org Thu Aug 24 19:33:17 2006 Return-path: Envelope-to: gexb-xemacs-beta@gmane.org Original-Received: from gwyn.tux.org ([199.184.165.135]) by ciao.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1GGJ4N-00063g-RX for gexb-xemacs-beta@gmane.org; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 19:32:44 +0200 Original-Received: from gwyn.tux.org (ident-user@localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by gwyn.tux.org (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id k7OHVeY4009348; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:31:40 -0400 Original-Received: from gwyn.tux.org (ident-user@localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by gwyn.tux.org (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id k7OHUvel008664 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:30:57 -0400 Original-Received: (from xemacweb@localhost) by gwyn.tux.org (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id k7OHUvgF008663 for xemacs-beta-post@xemacs.org; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:30:57 -0400 Original-Received: from gwyn.tux.org (ident-user@localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by gwyn.tux.org (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id k7OHUq6Y008609 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:30:52 -0400 Original-Received: (from mailnull@localhost) by gwyn.tux.org (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id k7OHUqZ0008605 for xemacweb@tux.org; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:30:52 -0400 Original-Received: from yxa.extundo.com (178.230.13.217.in-addr.dgcsystems.net [217.13.230.178]) by gwyn.tux.org (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id k7OHUX1N008509; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:30:52 -0400 Original-Received: from d-fens.mopniei.ru (mx.mo.msk.ru [62.213.85.9]) by yxa.extundo.com (8.13.4/8.13.4/Debian-3sarge2) with ESMTP id k7OHFrAR009404 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 19:15:53 +0200 Original-Received: from d-fens.mopniei.ru (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by d-fens.mopniei.ru (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id k7OHFTjt008609; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 21:15:29 +0400 Original-Received: (from gin@localhost) by d-fens.mopniei.ru (8.13.4/8.13.4/Submit) id k7OHFTAV008608; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 21:15:29 +0400 X-Authentication-Warning: d-fens.mopniei.ru: gin set sender to gin@mo.msk.ru using -f Original-To: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org, X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on gwyn.tux.org X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on gwyn.tux.org X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on gwyn.tux.org X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on gwyn.tux.org X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on yxa.extundo.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (gwyn.tux.org [0.0.0.0]); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:31:41 -0400 (EDT) X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (gwyn.tux.org [0.0.0.0]); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:30:57 -0400 (EDT) X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (gwyn.tux.org [0.0.0.0]); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:30:53 -0400 (EDT) X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (gwyn.tux.org [199.184.165.136]); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:30:52 -0400 (EDT) X-XEmacs-List: beta X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on gwyn.tux.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=AWL autolearn=no version=2.63 X-BeenThere: xemacs-beta@xemacs.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: XEmacs Beta Testers List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Archived-By-XEmacsArchiver: yes Original-Sender: xemacs-beta-bounces@xemacs.org Errors-To: xemacs-beta-bounces@xemacs.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.xemacs.beta:23394 gmane.emacs.bugs:15275 Archived-At: Emacs version: 21.4a. Merged from emacs 21 to xemacs 21.5 with the same bug, so cross- posting there. `beginning-of-line' (in emacs only: another inconsistency of the merge), `forward-paragraph' and many other commands by default refuse to move across field boundaries. It is not even stated so in their docstings, for `forward-paragraph' at least. Other commands on top of them are also affected by that, and in an obscure way. Viper vi state `f' command operate within paragraph boundary as determined by `forward-paragraph' (which is also not documented), and if the boundary is before the end of line due to fields, then characters on that line are not found as expected. It actually happens with default settings of `shell-mode', if point is in shell prompt and character to find is in command being edited, which are different fields set up by `comint'. There is even no interactive commands to check for fields explicitly. All of the field limiting only overloads existing point movement commands. Some packages may set different faces for different fields, like `comint' does (using `comint-highlight-prompt' face), or may set nothing except fields themselves. It is entirely up to package. And even if face with different foreground color (or other visual attributes) is set, differences between it and text outside the field may be visible or not visible on particular display / terminal. (With xemacs `comint.el' after revision 1.14 of 2006/05/25 it is even more complex. `comint-highlight-prompt' is used only for `font-lock-face' extent property, so there is an additional unknown of whether font lock mode is on. It is also not typical use of font lock to denote otherwise hidden text areas across which regular editing commands will refuse to move, and thus required in this case. Normally it is used for syntax structures which may be easily recognized otherwise, across which editing commands move freely, and thus optional.) Generally user has to resort to evaluating elisp expressions to figure what is going on. Or, in emacs, work around it all by setting `inhibit-field-text-motion t' locally. Can not do so in xemacs due to bug in its comint. For these reasons considering lack of interactive commands to check for field boundaries a bug. These commands should do the same regardless of minor modes, faces attributes and display capabilities in particular emacs process. Explicit error messages about hitting field boundary would be even better. ** Why still report for emacs 21. Limiting movements to fields as described appeared in 21 release branch only, as 1999-10-17 Miles Bader change. If users could have noticed that and complained about that in that time, it would be reasonable now to recommend them just to switch to new development branch from release 21 one. But at that time emacs cvs was not publicly readable. Such a recommendation would be at best unreasonable. It signals that now it is to complain about release 21 bugs. Until 21 release, it was to do so. When there was time to do so, then?