From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Sebastian Urban Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#35885: 25.2; Few mistakes in Emacs Manual (+ proposals) Date: Tue, 11 Jun 2019 12:32:36 +0200 Message-ID: <130c7584-e2ad-d521-d468-4119d462583a@gmail.com> References: <83k1e2tym6.fsf@gnu.org> <835zpltme6.fsf@gnu.org> <83muiwrn2u.fsf@gnu.org> <1583c6b3-2421-794d-8c8b-86287ef3fd5a@gmail.com> <83tvczb236.fsf@gnu.org> <616312d4-0faf-0382-3f21-5b66327d8d8b@gmail.com> <83tvcx9xyl.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Info: blaine.gmane.org; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:195.159.176.226"; logging-data="187157"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@blaine.gmane.org" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.7.0 Cc: 35885@debbugs.gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Jun 11 12:38:32 2019 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1haeAg-000maB-Mb for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; 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[89.161.9.216]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id q8sm2450000lfa.89.2019.06.11.03.32.36 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 11 Jun 2019 03:32:37 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <83tvcx9xyl.fsf@gnu.org> Content-Language: en-GB X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 209.51.188.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "bug-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:160355 Archived-At: > When N is negative, -N is positive, so the original text sounds > correct to me. Of course this way it's correct, but as you wrote few mails before "This is a user manual, not a mathematical paper (...)" and this (-1) x (-N) seems like unnecessary burden. And without it expressions like "... leaving -N spaces..." or (look below) "mark the previous −N files" makes no sense. Readers will more likely to interpret this '-' as negation of "previous" word. Just like D. Adams wrote "(...) it's not obvious - it's easy to misread it. Of course, it's not possible to leave a negative number of spaces (...). A careful reader will figure it out, but that might mean having to read it more than once." I was curious how it looks in other examples where 'N' is present, here is the list: 1. In INFO @ 11.2 Commands to Mark Textual Objects: A negative argument moves the mark back by N words. 2. In INFO @ 12.1.2 Killing by Lines: With a negative argument −N, it kills N lines preceding the current line, together with the text on the current line before point. 3. In INFO @ 14.2 Recentering: A negative argument -N puts point N lines from the bottom of the window. 4. In INFO @ 25.2 Sentences ... with a negative argument −N, it kills back to the beginning of the Nth preceding sentence. 5. In INFO @ 26.2.2 Moving by Defuns: ‘C-M-a’ with a negative argument −N moves forward N times to the next beginning of a defun. 6. In INFO @ 26.5.1 Comment Commands: A positive argument N adds N delimiters, while a negative argument -N removes N delimiters. ... With a positive prefix argument N, it operates on N lines starting with the current one; with a negative N, it affects N preceding lines. 7. In INFO @ 30.6 Dired Marks vs. Flags : [at '* m']... (if N is negative, mark the previous −N files)... ... [at '* u']... (if N is negative, unmark the previous −N files)... ... [at '* ']... (if N is negative, unmark the next −N files)... 8. In INFO @ 30.7 Operating on Files: (If N is negative, the command operates on the −N files preceding the current line.) --- end of examples --- So, in 2., 3., 4., 5., 6.(1st), we have pattern of "negative argument -N ... something N something..." In 1. it's something similar but without '-N' just "negative argument", also 6.(2nd) is something similar but 'N' doesn't have minus sign. But in 7. and 8. (and the one I already sent) we have "if N is negative... something -N something". So, after looking at more examples, I think the best idea would be to go with the most used pattern, therefore: - add '-N' to 1., - add minus sign do 6.(2nd), - replace - in 7., 8., and the one I sent - "if N is negative" with "with negative argument -N" then change '-N' to 'N' in the rest of each sentence. There is also a problem of minus sign, or to simply put - lack of it in 3. and 6.(1st) and the one I sent - there we can see "hyphen-minus" (#x2d). In other cases it is "minus sign" (#x2212). If we agree on this I could send message with "In FILENAME.TEXI L?-? change this line to this" if it helps you (I don't know how to make normal patches, sorry).